Welcome to Episode 441 of The Intermittent Fasting Podcast, hosted by Melanie Avalon, biohacker, founder of AvalonX, and author of What When Wine Diet: Lose Weight And Feel Great With Paleo-Style Meals, Intermittent Fasting, And Wine, and Barry Conrad, actor, singer-songwriter, and creator and host of Banter with BC.
SHOW NOTES
SPONSORS & DISCOUNTS
COWBOY COLOSTRUM
Looking to upgrade your gut, recovery, and resilience? With Cowboy Colostrum, you get pure first-day colostrum from grass-fed cows on regenerative U.S. farms - never diluted, never spray dried. Packed with immune factors, amino acids, and growth compounds, it’s a whole food support for digestion, performance, and longevity. Get 25% off with code IFPODCAST at cowboycolostrum.com.
HARVEST RIGHT
Ready to transform how you eat, prep, and save? With Harvest Right’s home freeze dryer, you can preserve everything from avocados to lasagna, locking in nutrients without preservatives or waste. Whether you're a biohacker, traveler, gardener, or pet parent, this is the ultimate hack for stocking your pantry with real food that lasts for years. Explore the magic of freeze drying at harvestright.com!
BIOPTIMIZERS
BiOptimizers’ Probiotic Breakthrough, featuring the patented P3OM strain, is a single-strain, stress-hardened probiotic designed to survive stomach acid and support gut health. It’s proteolytic, helping break down protein and improve overall nutrient absorption, while promoting a balanced gut microbiota. This plant-based, vegan-friendly, and travel-ready supplement multiplies in the gut for powerful effects without refrigeration. Get 15% off with code IFPODCAST15 at bioptimizers.com/ifpodcast.
SEED:
Get 25% off with code 25IFPODCAST at seed.com/IFPODCAST
LINKS
Featured Restaurant: Carbone
If you enjoyed this episode, please consider leaving us a review in Apple Podcasts!
Original theme composed by Leland Cox, and recomposed by Steve Saunders.
Our content does not constitute an attempt to practice medicine and does not establish a doctor-patient relationship. Please consult a qualified healthcare provider for medical advice and answers to personal health questions.
TRANSCRIPT
(Note: This is generated by AI with 98% accuracy. However, any errors may cause unintended changes in meaning.)
Melanie Avalon
Welcome to Episode 441 of the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. If you want to burn fat, gain energy, and enhance your health by changing when you eat, not what you eat, with no calorie counting, then this show is for you.
I'm Melanie Avalon, biohacker, founder of AvalonX, and author of What, When, Wine. Lose weight and feel great with paleo-style meals, intermittent fasting, and wine. And I'm joined by my co-hosts, Barry Conrad, actor, singer-songwriter, and creator and host of Banter with BC. For more on us, check out MelanieAvalon.com and BarryConradOfficial.com. You can submit questions for the show by emailing questions at iapodcast.com or by going to iapodcast.com. We would love to hear from you. Please remember, the thoughts and opinions on this show do not constitute medical advice or treatment. So, pour yourself a mug of black coffee, a cup of tea, or even a glass of wine if it's that time, and get ready for the Intermittent Fasting Podcast.
Hi, everybody, and welcome. This is episode number 441 of the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. I'm Melanie Avalon. I'm here with Barry Conrad. Barry, how are you today?
Barry Conrad
Hey, Mel. How's it going? I'm doing great. I'm doing really good today.
It's my weekend here. So I'm feeling pretty relaxed, but excited to be back on deck with you again, which is always exciting. And I'm still in Australia. How's everything going in ATL? How's your weekend been so far?
Melanie Avalon
Things are good. Barry, I wish you could have gone with me last night or the night before, whenever it was, to the event I went to. You might have seen it on Instagram. It was a women and wine event.
Barry Conrad
What happens there?
Melanie Avalon
It was the first annual women and wine event at the Fox Theater, which fun fact, I didn't know this. So the Fox Theater here at Atlanta where I go all the time and see shows, they are the highest grossing theater under 5000 seats in the entire world this year and last year.
Isn't that wild?
Barry Conrad
That's very impressive.
Melanie Avalon
So like ticket sales, wine sales, highest grossing, entire world under 5,000. Like it's a really, it's a big theater, but it's not, you know, like a stadium. Yeah, so kudos to them.
But last night or the night before, I went to this Women in Wine event and they had a lot of wineries represented from all over. They had a lot of local Atlanta, like people who are big in the wine sphere, like Sommelier's and like a girl from like the Sommelimpics and like local wine shops and you got to do tastings. And I actually found, I like went around, I felt really bad because I went, there were so many tastings and I would basically, this is how the conversation would go most of the time. I would like go up to the, you know, the booth or whatever. And I'd be like, do you have any organic wines? And if they're like, they usually be like, well, you know, no, but you know, and I was like, and I'd be like, okay, well, I only drink organic wine, then I would like leave. I felt really bad, I felt like really unsupportive.
So yeah, and then, and the second question was like, do you have any low alcohol wines? And they were just, yeah, I met, I met like this incredible, this incredible woman who works at, or who has a winery called Ancient Oak Cellars in California and she like used to be a neuroscientist and I don't know, it was really exciting.
And then I found this one winery that made these epic wines that were not technically organic, but you know, practicing organic and then low alcohol and tasted delicious and then very, are you ready? So they did like a panel and then they were giving away wines with raffle tickets and I won the first wine. Do you know the moment of like holding the raffle ticket and they like read the numbers and it's like your number? It was like a $500 bottle of wine.
Barry Conrad
That's awesome. What kind of one was it?
Melanie Avalon
It's a Chardonnay.
Barry Conrad
And you don't normally drink, you drink a lot more red, right? So this is a good little change.
Melanie Avalon
Why I'm not going to, so it was, it's called, it's called Morley. Apparently it was like a really exclusive bottle.
I'm going to give it to my dad for Christmas. He doesn't listen to the show, so he won't know that.
Barry Conrad
That's a really good gift. Five hundred dollar bottle of wine, damn.
Melanie Avalon
I know and but like the moment of I was getting like all the flashbacks of childhood when you're like doing raffles and bingo and Stuff. Have you ever won anything like?
Barry Conrad
It's such a good feeling because like, it's like, it's me, it's me. It's like, what numbers is me?
Melanie Avalon
It's okay, I like jumped up like screaming. Everybody's like cheering. I feel like I've like saved the world or something.
Barry Conrad
I could just pick your face you'd be so happy.
Melanie Avalon
Oh my gosh. Yeah. Wait, what's it? What's the biggest thing you've won?
Barry Conrad
biggest thing that I've won. Gosh, like, I think like a meat hamper, which is actually perfect for me because I like me. Oh, what? A meat hamper.
Melanie Avalon
A what? A meat hamper?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, you know what that it like it's kind of like basically like a big thing of me like a basket for like all this Meat like steaks, you know, do you guys have to have meat hampers and stuff? That's very Aussie
Melanie Avalon
oh okay like a gift basket yeah yeah like a meat box like a box of meat yeah
Barry Conrad
Meet hamper
Melanie Avalon
Meat hamper is not coming up like it's like the thing I mean, it's coming. Wait, meat hamper Australia. I'm seeing if this is like an Australian word. This is like a meat hamper, you know, beef. You know what? And this must be Australian because like the first thing that comes up is beef and brew, gift, hampers made in Australia, Australian meat, emporium, gift packs with hampers are artisan hampers.
Okay. Meat mates.
Barry Conrad
All these different things. It's going to be changing soon. You know, the more I, when I'm back home, it'll be all the same. Yeah, that's exciting though. The wine, that's so cool.
Melanie Avalon
It was so fun and it was really nice to be in a supportive community of a lot of women, empowering women and all the things. So it was fun, but you could have come with me and had fun.
Barry Conrad
That's just a woman's thing, right? Isn't it just like, you know, a lot of estrogen?
Melanie Avalon
It was called women and wine, but there were some men there supporting the women. If you like to support the women, oh, oh, and then, wait, actually really quick, my favorite wine that I got, like it was like a man, there was like a lot of men representing the places.
And then at the very end, so not only did I want a bottle of wine, by the end I had a lot of wine in me. And then they just came up and like gave me another bottle. I don't even know who gave it to me, but my friend was like, they said they have a gift for us. And then yeah, they came and just gave us more bottles of wine. And I don't know who gave it to me. I know somebody specifically wanted to give it to us, but I don't know who it's like, it's like secret Santa or something.
Barry Conrad
It's like a wine admirer, an admirer of yours. Yeah.
How good is that? How about you? You know what? I think I may have mentioned this to you, Mel, but early this week, actually, I was walking into the rehearsal room, into the building.
Melanie Avalon
Yes, I'm excited. I was hoping you're going to tell this story.
Barry Conrad
Yeah. And our director for Destiny, the play that I'm doing, her name is Zindzi Okenyo. She's amazing. Shout out to Zindzi.
She was walking up with the headphones on. It's like, Hey, how's it going? It's like, I just finished, I was just listening to you listening to your podcast. I'm like, which one is because the intermittent fasting podcast. And it's like, really? And my face lit up and she had so many genuine questions. She's like, it's so interesting. Wait, so we need to talk about this. And she was like trying to ask all these questions before we got started for the day. And she's like, I actually think I want to give this a go. I have more questions. I'll talk to you at lunch. And so she was super curious about it, but I was also saying to Mel listeners, how people can get, so after spending a bit of time with you, because now we're three weeks in, right? So people see you during lunch break and whether you eat, whether you don't eat and people are like, so I've noticed, you're not really eating, you're not really eating, like what's the deal? And then they start asking and it's like, yes, now I can share about it. But I will say reactions go from shock to offended to curious to like, super curious. So it's really interesting to see people's journey. Cause they see that you're not making it a big deal. And then they start asking more about it. And then they listened to the podcast and now someone else is listening to it as well. So it's great.
Melanie Avalon
So amazing when you and I were talking about it before and you were mentioning it now, it's like you got to let like not them come to you but you know like we don't go out there just like preaching fasting and throwing in people's faces like let the people ask the questions when they want to. I feel like most people come around like as far as like not being shocked anymore at the very least.
Barry Conrad
Definitely. And even Kirstie Morelia was also the playwright. When I told her, she's like, oh, you fast. How long? And I said, 20 hours. And she goes, 20 hours. She was like, she literally like, she was so shocked. And then now she's just so curious about it. She's like, that's so cool. Asking all these questions. It's great.
I love it. I love when people come to us and we have the podcast that we can just say, listen to this and answers all the questions.
Melanie Avalon
And to that point, so like the 20 hours reaction, I remember it's so like interesting to think back on our own lives. Like I remember back in the day when 20 hours would have seemed like so long to me, you know, but now that doesn't even like, I don't even think about hours really.
Like nothing faces me. Remember before you tried like, like way back in the day, 20 would have seemed kind of crazy.
Barry Conrad
And also I think when people realize you've been doing it for a long time as well, that's like, ah, so this is not just like a week long thing like you've been doing for like seven years. Yeah, exactly.
Melanie Avalon
Not a fling.
Barry Conrad
Not a fling. So shout out to, and again, like, I think I can speak for both of us when I say that we definitely do not, as Melanie said, preach to anyone about this.
Like we love this. And that's why Melanie created this podcast and why I'm a co-host. We genuinely are passionate about intermittent fasting. And it's so great when people have questions and they're happy to share, but we never, I don't think either of us lead with, Hey, I'm Barry and I'm an intermittent fasto. Like, it's just, it's not our shtick. And I don't think that's any way to be in general, whether that's any kind of views, you know, like, let me preach at people and hit them over the head with what I think, you know,
Melanie Avalon
Exactly. Like, I'm really fascinated by the concept of identity in general. And I don't, at least for me, I don't feel like my identity should ever be wedded to something that I do, even though I probably do that.
I probably consider actually, I'm like saying this, but then I actually do think of myself as like a podcaster, like a, but but I don't know, the idea of like identity and like, I'm a vegan or I'm a faster, I'm a carnivore is really interesting, because life changes.
Barry Conrad
It does. It really does.
Melanie Avalon
And you don't have to do like one window your whole life either with fasting.
Barry Conrad
I also did say to Kirsty, shout out to Kirsty as well, I said to her, this is a way, it's not the way, like nothing that we do is the way, like this worked for me and I love it so much, but I'm not trying to tell you that you should do it or you have to do it to be happier, to be healthy. I can share why it's so beneficial, but I'm not trying to tell you or preach to you and she was like, oh, that's so true and that's right.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, exactly. Like, I think if anybody ever says like, this is the only way, especially like diet and fitness, like, probably don't listen to them, or listen and take what's helpful. But you know, be skeptical and congrats on destiny.
So this comes out September 29. So the show will be going on, right?
Barry Conrad
So the show and put it just just finish so yeah you like.
Melanie Avalon
Well, congratulations, very future berry.
Barry Conrad
I know. That's pretty well. The time is flying, so it's going pretty quickly. When you have it.
Melanie Avalon
Having fun. Yeah. All right. Well, shall we jump into some fasting things, speaking of?
Let's do it. So I have a study to start us off with. So this study is called the impact of intermittent fasting and Mediterranean diet on older adults, physical health and quality of life, a randomized clinical trial. So this was published in nutrition, metabolism and cardiovascular diseases, May 2025. So this year, pretty new. And what I liked about this study, so I feel like there can be a problem sometimes, not a problem, but something to keep in mind with a lot of intermittent fasting studies is they'll just look at like fasters versus non-fasters, but then that doesn't really take into account what the people are eating, you know, which sometimes that's the point because sometimes what you're looking for is can just fasting, you know, have certain effects regardless of what you're eating. It's also nice though, if you're eating the same thing, because then you can more tell specifically like the actual effects of the fasting, because the diet is controlled to be the same. And what's interesting about this study is they were looking at they were using a quote, like a healthy diet that has been shown to have beneficial effects and then comparing it, that healthy diet to that diet plus fasting. And the diet they're using was the Mediterranean diet. So the study included, they started out with 20 people ended up with 17. And it was all adults over the age of 60. So this was older adults. And they were given a Mediterranean diet that was tailored to their preferences. So they made sure that it was a diet that they, you know, enjoyed. And it included things like olive oil, fish, nuts, legumes, fruit, whole grains, they were encouraged not to eat refined grains. Let's see what else. The specific things they were encouraged to do was three pieces of fruit per day, whole grains instead of refined grains, legumes two to four times per week, vegetables two times per week, olive oil as the main fat, eating more fish than meat, avoiding red and cured meat, eating three to seven eggs a week, eating two servings of dairy products per day. Interesting. So they had, again, so they had the Mediterranean diet or they had a Mediterranean diet with time restricted eating. And this was not a long fast that they had them do. So the people who were doing the Mediterranean diet with fasting, it was only 12 hours. For me, I would put that at like bare minimum. I feel like 12 hours is right when you're kind of switching over to the fasted state. So it's interesting to me that they found the effects they found, even with such a small fast. And even with not that big of a difference from the control group who weren't fasting, because those people, their fasting time was anywhere from eight to 10 and a half hours. So some of the people in the non-fasting group were still just not that far away from 12 hours. But the average amount of fasting time in the non-fasting group was 9.11 hours. They found both groups, so things in common. They both had improved quality of life. They both had better stool consistency and regularity.
Melanie Avalon
So constipation and digestive issues can definitely be an issue for people. And I think constipation, especially in older adults, can be a problem.
So it's nice that they saw improved quality there. As far as the markers they were looking at, so the fasting group specifically saw significant reductions in their BMI, so in their weight, in their waist circumference, their hip circumference, and their blood pressure. So it seemed that the fasting arm had a greater effect on central adiposity, so that unhealthy visceral fat around the waist, which is really important for health, like not having that. So the fasting had a more beneficial effect on that and also a more beneficial effect on liver health accordingly. Interestingly, they saw a better effect on GGT in the Mediterranean diet. And GGT is a liver enzyme that can be elevated and it was actually not, it was benefited more by the non-fasting group. And I was really hoping that they would comment more on why that might be, but they didn't really. All they said was that the significant decrease in GGT levels in the Mediterranean diet group, compared to the fasting group, aligns with the results of a meta-analysis conducted by Sanguini et al., which reported a significant reduction in GGT levels across the eight included studies. So the conclusion of the researchers was that both of these approaches, so just the Mediterranean diet and the Mediterranean diet with fasting, had positive effects.
So they, just in general, they positively influenced various health conditions and individuals over age 60. That said, specifically the fasting group resulted in significant reductions in BMI, waist, hip circumference, and also systolic blood pressure. Something though that was interesting was the Mediterranean diet group only. So the non-fasting group, 100% of them wanted to keep going when it was done. They felt like they could keep going and adhere, but only 20% of the fasting group did. So I'm really intrigued by this because in the past, I feel like in general, one of the benefits of fasting type approaches is adherence usually tends to be high.
I've seen so many studies on this where when people do fasting, they are really able to adhere to it without wanting to drop off or stop doing it. And so something I wonder, so they have some ideas that they proposed for why this may be. This study took place in Spain, and they said that Spain actually has one of the longest eating windows anywhere. So they start eating at like 7 a.m. normally, and they tend to stop eating it. They'll have dinner at 10 p.m. So the population is a population that is not used to the fasting type approach. It also might be that older adults have problems adhering to the fasting approach than younger populations. And then my theory about it is, this is my theory, is because they were putting them on a Mediterranean diet, I would imagine that that naturally, because now they're switching to like a whole foods type diet, a healthy diet,
Melanie Avalon
they probably naturally were calorie restricting, or at least compared to what they were before. So it could be, I have a few theories, it could be that the, you know, switching to a diet that would create more of a calorie restriction and fasting, which is too much for them to adhere to. And they're older and they're in Spain, where they're used to eating all throughout the day. But basically, so I found it really interesting that there were more beneficial effects in the fasting group.
And yet they, you know, were not so much down to continue doing it, only 20% wanted to keep doing it. So yeah, Barry, do you have thoughts on this?
Barry Conrad
That's such a great study, and to echo what you just said just now, I think that's really surprising because you say that the Mediterranean diet group who also fasted was only 12 hours, which is not long.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, that reminded me of my other thought, which is like, maybe they weren't actually getting into the fasted state enough to get the appetite suppression effects, you know? Because it's like, if you're just like, if you're right at the cusp, but you're not actually really getting into ketosis, because you're not fasting long enough, then you're probably just going to kind of feel the misery of not eating without it, without it becoming easy. So in a way, like, fasting less can actually make it harder, I think, for some people.
Barry Conrad
Definitely. It's not surprising. I mean, it is, but now that you said that, that's a good point. You're just not there yet.
You haven't really switched into that state. You're still in the struggle street state. Because it's only what? Nine and a half hours on average for the nonfasting group and then 12 hours for the other year. That's not much time difference at all between the two.
Melanie Avalon
I almost wonder like if they have been fasting in the fasting group like 14, 15, 16 hours, would it have been easier for them? I think it actually might have been.
Barry Conrad
I had a thought when you're talking about the blood work as well.
My mom actually told me just two days ago that she started intermittent fasting.
I think I told you that, but she just got her bloods done.
And she said, she's like, I've just got my bloods done.
And they're like, amazing.
Like the best they've ever been.
And when I did them last year, they were not great.
And the only thing that I've changed is now I'm consistently intermittent fasting.
So,
Melanie Avalon
Oh wow, amazing.
Barry Conrad
It's amazing. She said it's definitely the fasting. That's really encouraging.
It's great that the BMI went down. It's great that they're still finding these benefits, even with just the 12-hour fast. It just goes to show you don't have to, even though, yes, maybe you're not feeling like you're in that state because it's 12 hours, there's still benefits. Non-scale.
Melanie Avalon
So yeah, it's like, it's funny, because we're saying both things. We're saying like, maybe the less fasting made it harder. And maybe they would have seen more benefits.
But still, like you said, literally, they said, TRE, so time restricted eating combined with the Mediterranean diet offers superior health benefits compared to the Mediterranean diet alone. So they still saw benefits even with not that long of a fast. And something of note, that's something I was going to note was was going to point out they did, like teach the people how to ease into fasting. So they did like counsel them on how to do that.
Barry Conrad
I wonder how they show them that. I wonder how they demonstrated it or if they just sent them a document to read or how that worked.
I can tell you. Let's see. I also thought it was really interesting about the GGT and why it improved a bit better in the nonfasting group.
Melanie Avalon
So GGT, I know it's related to muscle. It's like it's a liver enzyme
Barry Conrad
But I wonder what the difference would be if it's just a few hours, essentially.
Melanie Avalon
So it's an enzyme primarily found in your liver. It's also in your bile ducts, your kidneys, your pancreas and your spleen. It plays a key role in the transport of amino acids and in the body's glutathione metabolism, which is crucial for detox.
Let's see. So, well, TragiBT is saying that fasting can potentially affect GGT, but usually only mildly and not in a way that's likely to cause major spikes or drops. Yeah, I really wish they had commented more on it because I found that really interesting but they kind of didn't really talk about it. To answer your question about how they were taught to do fasting, and before I say that, just because I'm reading now, they said they chose a 12-hour fasting period because it is less restrictive than shorter eating windows and it aligns more closely with typical eating patterns, making it easier for older individuals to adopt and maintain. They were guided through a structured process. So they had a consultation and then they got detailed instructions on how to gradually adjust their meal timing. So for example, because they got to pick their eating window, so if they typically ate from 7 a.m. to 9 p.m., then they were advised to make their first meal 8 a.m. and 8 p.m. and then slowly, well, I guess that would have done it. That would be a 12-hour window. But so they were advised on how to shift it down.
Barry Conrad
This isn't related but not, but this week we had our first, well this will be in the past now, but when we had our first full run-through of the play and they introduced actual edible food because there's scenes where we're actually eating, like there's something called a...
Melanie Avalon
Can you actually eat on stage?
Barry Conrad
you actually eat. So there's a, it's something called a Bri in South Africa, which is a barbecue. I've talked about that before. And basically we had like baked potatoes or barbecue potatoes. And I just decided I'm going to do it. It was like, I want to say, it was like 10 30, 11 AM in the morning. But I thought for the sake of everyone is using drinking the liquids and eating the foods for the purpose of the scene. So it was like, I'm just doing it today, but I'll tell you Mel, as soon as I had that one bite of potato, for the rest of the day, I was in agony. It was like, Oh, I'm so hungry. And just again, I'll let it again. Like I don't think about, I do not get hungry when I'm fasting. I don't.
Melanie Avalon
It's so true. And it's wild how like the one little bite can because it starts back up that digestive system, messes with your insulin, like it's kind of crazy to me, you know, and people might not understand if they haven't tried fasting, they're like, Oh, how can one bite, you know, matter?
I'm like, Yeah, I just need to stay in the fastest state in my good my good zone.
Barry Conrad
But that also again relates back to the group doing 12 hours, maybe it's just not quite enough time to get past that feeling of like, I'm hungry, you know.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, that's what I feel might be happening. So, okay.
Barry Conrad
Great study, Mel.
Melanie Avalon
Thank you. And also congrats on your first full run.
Barry Conrad
Thank you, thank you.
Melanie Avalon
I mean every, every episode, sorry, every show you eat on stage.
Barry Conrad
Yes, there's a scene where I drink quite a lot, but it's just water and a beer bottle, which is fine, which is fine. I also, by the way, I also have to smoke on stage.
Melanie Avalon
Wow, you know what we should talk about the question that was related to that actually like actually spoke like cigarette spoke
Barry Conrad
So with theater, and they do this in screen as well, they have like menthol cigarettes. So it looks exactly like a cigarette. It's not completely foolproof.
So I'm going to talk to them to see if there's another option as well, because the menthol, it kind of inhibits that it makes you feel like you can inhale more smoke because you don't feel that, that, you know, nicotine in that, that tobacco. So that can still be damaging if you're inhaling so much more, because it's easier to smoke, but I have to smoke in the, the play a couple of times. Yeah.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, wow. So it's is so it does have it is like smoking, it's just less of the stuff.
Barry Conrad
It's like menthol, I need to, it's not technically toxic, but I think cause you're inhaling more smoke easily, it's still going to make you more prone to.
That's not great.
So I'll see if there's another solution, but it's, I got to do it for the.
Melanie Avalon
looked it up. Yeah, I just looked. I just, I just asked Chad about it. It says menthol smoking is toxic with some added concerns. Oh.
Barry Conrad
Oh gosh, okay.
Melanie Avalon
All cigarettes contain harmful substances tar carbon monoxide formaldehyde benzene ammonia arsenic whoa hydrogen cyanide I didn't know that what menthol adds menthol is a chemical that gives a cooling menti sensation it doesn't eliminate the toxins it just masks it increases nicotine absorption.
Barry Conrad
Well, I'm going to ask if, because I know there's two different options, but that's the one that they cost. Well, that's not great because I used to be a smoker. I think I've told you this before.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, they're banned in the European Union and Canada.
Barry Conrad
Really?
Melanie Avalon
uh-huh
Barry Conrad
So, listeners, don't do as I do. I'm doing this for a role, an acting job, but I'm going to try to see if there's a different solution or a different type of cigarette, because I do need to smoke for the play, but...
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, we did not plan this. But we have a question about this. We didn't plan this at all. Should we do the question about this?
Barry Conrad
Let's do it. So Amy sent an email in and the subject heading was smoking while doing IF. And she's like, I know, I know. Smoking is bad, but this is a question from my husband who wants to start doing IF along with me.
He is doing OMAD and eats around 6 to 7 PM and doesn't have any snacks. But he tends to smoke throughout the day. So is smoking during his fasted period? He is doing IF for weight loss purposes, because clearly he's not too healthy if he's still smoking. Anyway, does smoking increase insulin slash break a fast? Should he increase his eating window and only smoke during the window? Melanie, what do you think?
Melanie Avalon
Really good question and interesting. I don't think we've received this question on the show before and like over 440 episodes and the answer is gonna be really interesting at least I think it is so smoking I mean, I think most people are pretty much aware that smoke like smokers tend to be thinner and Smoking is linked to weight loss and there's a few different reasons for that but nicotine itself Seems to have a lot of beneficial effects on Weight specifically so it has a an appetite suppressing effect nicotine does it affects energy expenditure in part by actually it actually can encourage the formation of brown adipose tissue and Like it affects the the regulation of energy there and what brown adipose tissue is it's it's basically called brown fat And it's a type of fat that actually burns calories for energy So it's a healthy type of fat So nicotine has a beneficial effect by increasing energy expenditure in that type of fat in your body Again, and then it can also turn white fat into that brown fat but also could help with glucose regulation and it can increase just energy expenditure in general and The way it does this it might do this by affecting activity in our hypo thalamic Neuropeptide system in our brain also by affecting AMPK, which is something we talk about a lot in this show But AMPK is an energy sensor mechanism in the body that it's activated by fasting.
It's protective of longevity nicotine might actually like increase those levels and this is a reason that I think smoking tends to be Ironically, it's been linked to longevity in certain populations like certain Centenarian populations Some of them it's thought that like there's smoking might actually be having a beneficial effect.
I know this is really controversial and wild I'm not seeing the smoke smoking isn't that good? Congratulations, by the way, very on quitting because I know that's you know, really hard and not easy to do and at the same time Nicotine does seem to have beneficial effects.
I Like the dopamine effect from it. It's preventative of Parkinson's maybe preventative of Alzheimer's so this is a long way of saying that nicotine itself and because you're getting nicotine from smoking it actually May help weight loss.
It's not gonna hurt your your weight loss effects Does it break the fast? No, it doesn't have calories in it And if anything, it's like I said helping you burn fat And I know that's a really like ironic a controversial answer, especially because you know, you're saying Amy for your husband. He's doing IF for weight loss Because he's clearly he's not too healthy if he's still smoking So yes the smoking very unhealthy not good That said smoking is probably actually helping him in his weight loss efforts So just as like a heads up if he stops smoking, you know, he might gain weight He might find it harder to lose weight So he might want to try a like a nicotine type patch approach, especially if he's weeding off and then as well The smoking itself is not gonna break the fast.
Melanie Avalon
That said the opportunity I see here is If he's just smoking in his eating window, then he's cutting down on smoking, which is great. So I almost wish it did break the fast because then you could be like, oh you can't have it while fasting because You know because then that would be a way to kind of like help cut down on the smoking So should he only smoke during the window? I'd say yes because that's Gonna help with his health and getting off of smoking.
Does it break the fast? No.
What are your thoughts Barry?
Barry Conrad
Oh, you answered that. You nailed that. Mel was so great at exactly what you said.
Smoking, it doesn't really, it doesn't trigger an incident response like carbs or anything else. So it's not technically breaking it as a former smoker. It's really, really hard to quit. It took me three times to quit, but it's so worth it. I think that baby steps and progress over perfection. So I think, no, I think I know it would be beneficial for him to stick to, or to try smoking within his eating window. Cause as Mel said, it's going to help him maybe wean off it over time. And also, yeah, you'll just be smoking less, which means better health. So there's nothing more that I can really add to that, but it is really interesting how I did not know that it had all those benefits as well.
And all like nicotine. And also it made me want to ask, how did you, and why did you want to start wearing a patch? Like who told you about it? How did you find it about that? Do you really notice much of a difference? Yeah, that's interesting.
Melanie Avalon
I have a question for you as well about your experience quitting. But to answer your question, when did I first start using nicotine patches? I've used them for a long time.
They're actually, they're kind of, they're one of the things in the biohacking world that people experiment with. I think I probably just heard about them on different podcasts. Like I know Dave Asprey has talked about them a lot as have other like biohacking type people. And I've like seen the beneficial effects on them for like the studies on them for being preventative for cognitive decline and Parkinson's and the way for me personally, cause I think, I think when it comes to any sort of substance, so alcohol, nicotine, marijuana, even like psychedelics, like they're all these different caffeine, like all these different substances, some work well with people's body chemistry, some don't, or even all the, even like pharmaceutical drugs, like, you know, people who are, take like Xanax or something, like people react all differently to different substances. So I think it's important to know things important to like weigh the cost benefit of things, the harm or not, you know, how addictive is it to you? How does it make you feel? Like again, what is the cost benefit? And when it comes to nicotine patches, I can't, like you don't have the carcinogenic effect of smoking. Yes, it can be addictive at the same time. You don't have the addiction, social cues of smoking. So it's not like where, cause a lot of, I've, and I'd be curious your thoughts, your thoughts on this, but from what I've read, a lot of smoking addiction, a lot of it can be the, like you're used to like having a cigarette and like that, like that activity itself becomes really addictive in addition to the nicotine, whereas like with a patch, if you've never smoked and you're only doing a patch, you just put a patch on or don't put a patch on. And you can like titrate up dose or titrate down dose. So you don't have that, that environmental social thing that comes with smoking that I think can be really hard for people to get through. But I just really liked the way dopamine makes me feel like it makes my brain really alert, helps me focus. Yeah, I don't see any, I don't personally experience any negative effects from it. And if I were to not put one on, I probably wouldn't notice if that makes sense. So like, I like the added benefit I get, but if I don't put one on, I don't really, it's not a big deal. I will say if you experiment with the nicotine batch, start slow, because if you just, you will get sick if you put on too much, trust me. And I didn't realize it the first time either, because I put one on and I, and then I got so sick, like I was like throwing up and I was like, what is happening? I haven't, and then I was like, oh, so yeah, be careful. When you quit, what was the thing that, because it's that you said it took you three times, what, like what actually did it for you the third time?
Barry Conrad
Thanks for sharing before as well. I'm really curious to maybe even try out this patch situation.
Melanie Avalon
I love my nicotine.
Barry Conrad
The three times were in a pretty short-term succession, like I tried three times, but the biggest kicker for me was my voice and my career and health. I'm so passionate about my health and fitness and always have been.
I'm like, long game, do I want this? Do I want this to be in my life long-term? No. So, I just kind of had to do it. Like the why became bigger than the habit.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, totally makes sense. It's funny.
So when I was looking through my goodie bag from the last biohacking conference they and one of the things in it because they gave us like a lot of things. One of the things was actually like nicotine, like chewable things. I actually haven't tried it because I've actually never tried like a chewable nicotine. Maybe I should try it sometime.
But I just think it's funny that that was literally in like our biohacking like gift bag.
Barry Conrad
And so I need to try these things. I just had no idea that even the patch was a thing. Like you could wear one just to like, do you feel, is it like a, is it a slow release since like, what's the situation?
Melanie Avalon
I buy a 21 milligram patch and I cut it into four.
So, you know, a little bit over three milligrams and it's slow release.
And that's, so it's a tiny amount that I'm putting on.
I've done more than that in the past, but interesting.
Yeah.
And it feels for me, it just, it's kind of just like a little, like, little dopamine, some good focus, you know, feeling productive.
Barry Conrad
Well, Amy, we hope that that is helpful, and good luck to your husband. Hopefully that'll keep us posted.
Melanie Avalon
Yes, please, please do, please do. I wish you could tell them that it breaks the fast, but to be super clear, I'm not saying to smoke. Smoking, not good. Carcinogenic, not good.
Barry Conrad
Isn't that so interesting that this is the first, like, I'm surprised. I've actually never thought of that, of people asking those questions like, does smoking break the fast? No one's ever asked that before.
Melanie Avalon
If anything it supports the fast ironically because it i don't want to say that but you know it helps you burn fat increases energy expenditure it kills your appetite that's why just try nicotine instead if you want those benefits.
Barry Conrad
my mom's side of the family, Mel, like smokers, like really, really smoke. And they always used to say, yeah, it doesn't make me angry.
I could just, I just have to just keep smoking. I don't get angry. You just like, you know, they just smoke away.
Melanie Avalon
I mean, a lot of people, that's why people, you know, stop smoking and they gain weight.
Barry Conrad
We're not sent to smoke, everyone just saying disclaimer or not, yeah.
Melanie Avalon
I know, I know, I have to be so clear about that.
Barry Conrad
Okay, so Kimberly on Facebook asks when to take supplements. I overthink this.
Melanie Avalon
Awesome question, Kimberly. So it is very easy, I think, to overthink this one. And it's still it's still a really good question. And there are things to keep in mind.
So most supplements, I mean, you really want to look at ingredients and make sure they don't have, you know, things in them like maltodextrin, which is a form of sugar and, you know, oils and toxins and things like that. So you want to get really clean, pure supplements. But as far as like when to take it, the way I look at it is, if it's like a food based supplement, I tend to take it with food. So like, if it's magnesium, I'm like, I take that with my food because it like adds the nutrition, I actually take the vitamin, I take vitamin D with, because that's something we would be getting, well, we get that from the sun, but we also can get it from food. I actually, because it's like fat soluble, take it with my food, even though I then I take it at night and vitamin D they'll often say to take during the day because of its effects on circadian rhythm. But like spirulina that I consider a supplement I take with my food. So food related nutrients, you can take, you know, with your food. Things like mycelia peptase, which is great to support the fast, break down problematic proteins in your body, clear your allergies, take that in the fasted state, preferably right when you wake up. Something that's really going to help you with blood sugar control like berberine, you're going to want to take that definitely before meals to help with the blood sugar response of the meal. When it comes to things like just neurotropics or, you know, like adaptogens to not ever think it, I would just look at the bottle. Like when does the bottle say to take it and take it accordingly? I interviewed, so Jay Campbell, I had him on the Melanie Avalon biohacking podcast. He's also going to be coming on this show as well. He's really big with peptides. He does make a really strong case in his book, one of his books, that if you really want the full beneficial effect of a supplement, that it should be taken not with other things, which I know is hard when we're taking like a million things. But if you're taking something specifically for like fat burning or like peptide related like that, isolating it is going to probably give you a more potent effect. But again, it's really hard to do that when you're taking lots of things. But so like my daily supplement routine, the ones I think are really important about timing are like seropeptase in a fasted state, really important. Burberry, making sure that it's before meals, although I also take it in the morning to the morning, the afternoon when I get up to support the fasted state. Obviously, things like digestive enzymes and HCL, anything that's food support will be taken with your meals. Circadian rhythm related things like melatonin or magnesium, my magnesium nightcap, which crosses the blood-brain barrier you can take in the evening to support your sleep.
Melanie Avalon
So really, yes, don't overthink it. Look at the supplement and ask yourself what is this supporting? Is this supporting something about the food and digestion? Then take it with the meal.
Is it supporting my sleep? Take it in the evening.
Does it need to be on an empty stomach like your thyroid medication or seropeptase on an empty stomach?
I'm trying to think there's any other like big blanket categories of things. I like the way she started though, which is don't overthink it. You can always just look at the bottle.
What do you think, Burry?
Barry Conrad
When it comes to supplements or medication for that matter as well, I just follow the bottle. Like, I'm not going to overthink that at all when it comes to that.
I think if it's something that you're taking by choice, which is not like a medication that's more of a supplement, then yeah, like Mel said, food-related, take it with food. If it's not relevant to that, I do like the idea of what you said. What was the guest that you mentioned before, Mel? The guy that talked about? Jay Campbell. Yeah, I love the idea and I really agree taking... To me it makes sense that isolating those kinds of supplements would be more potent. You don't think? Because I think that makes sense to me.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, and like things like, if you're taking some sort of like fat burning supporting compound, which there are quite a few different supplements out there, you might want to, you know, take them by themselves. Also, if you're evaluating how something makes you feel, like nicotine, for example, you probably want to take it for the first time when you put it on like not with other things so you can see, you know how it's making you feel.
I feel good because I just I was curious and I put in chat GPT, like when to take supplements and I feel like I did cover because I was like, I feel like I'm making this specific to me, but I think those are the pretty big categories, like some things I left out. So B vitamins. So those are going to be energizing. That's something to keep in mind.
Like is this energizing? If so you want to take it earlier. So B vitamins might be energizing.
Barry Conrad
melatonin, take it at night, you know?
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, something like zinc that going back to like taking with food people sometimes sometimes get nausea from that So you would want to take that with food other ones at night might be like L theanine CBD or I left that out CBD Gaba, you know, those are gonna help with sleep probiotics.
I would probiotics. I would take with food unless it says Not to so like seed probiotic, which I adore It's one of my favorite probiotics of all time that you're gonna take on an empty stomach is how they say to take it I will give you a link for that by the way you
Barry Conrad
Yeah, and even things like, I guess, fish oil or spirulina, like, you know, you can clearly also see the food related, so probably take them in my eating window, you know?
Melanie Avalon
The fish oil one is really interesting and really quickly so for seed which is my favorite probiotic seed.com slash if podcast with the code 25 if podcast will get you 25% off.
The fish oil is so interesting because historically I always thought taking it with food and that's what chat GPT is saying and still I've read some of the people and I'm running together in my head who said what but some books that I read they say fish oil like take it in the fasted state and then some say only take it with food so fish oil I'm really on the fence I personally would take it with food though.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, but it is a really good question, and actually it seems simple, but I'm glad that she asked that. So thanks for your question.
Melanie Avalon
Yes, awesome, awesome. Shall we break our proverbial fast?
Barry Conrad
I think we should do it. I'm so excited about this restaurant.
Melanie Avalon
Okay, Barry, I am so excited. What restaurant do you have for us today?
Barry Conrad
Okay, so I have chosen a restaurant that I think you're going to love. It's called Carbon, I think it's pronounced that way, and it's based in New York City.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, I know you gotta start and you can go to these places.
Barry Conrad
Exactly. So, this place, why it's special, it's got a retro chic revival of mid-century Italian-American dining situation from a major food group, and it was opened in Greenwich Village in 2013.
It's got ala card gems like Spicer, Rigatoni, vodka, and veal parmesan. Each plate rendered with theatrical polish, which I think you'd like, Mel.
Melanie Avalon
with what? Theactrical?
Barry Conrad
Theatrical polish like theatrical flair.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, oh, okay. Oh, okay. I thought you were saying like, like a literal substance that was called theatrical polish. I was like, what is theatrical polish? I want it, but yeah.
Barry Conrad
Nearly every dish is table side plated, which I actually love that idea, which marries nostalgia with modern hospitality and one of the things you're going to love is the wine list is extensive and Italian selection.
Melanie Avalon
Table-side all of them table-side plated almost that's cool
Barry Conrad
Yeah, and the vibe which haven't been yet but apparently it's like a dark leather booth with emerald bank bank it's set against glossy white tablecloth tops perfect for indulgent date nights or lively group dinner so sounds like my kind of place have you seen a looking at it.
Melanie Avalon
Yes, I'm at the I'm at the website. The yeah, the vibe is totally oh Locations they have another location.
Oh, New York, Miami, Dallas, Las Vegas, Hong Kong, Doha, Ria Coming soon to Dubai and London. I want to go
Barry Conrad
Well, when you come to New York, this is great because we could do this and I can come to the ones in Atlanta. I know. Let's go to the dinner menu and see what we got there.
Melanie Avalon
We get to use Italian words for the category so we don't have to fight over, like, entree appetizer-ness.
Barry Conrad
The mains, entree, yeah.
Melanie Avalon
Okay so antipasti.
Barry Conrad
Antipasti, anything they're grabbing, catching your eye.
Melanie Avalon
actually yes I want the okay so actually I want two things I want the prosciutto and melon will you eat the melon
Barry Conrad
Yeah, definitely.
Melanie Avalon
And then I want to taste a baked clam, but I don't want the whole thing.
Barry Conrad
I knew you were going to say that.
Melanie Avalon
I've never had, I don't think I've had clamps, which is, I think we've talked about this.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, we have. I'm getting the deja vu, but also I can't remember why you said no.
Melanie Avalon
last week we talked about the bubble room at Sanibel and like clams are on probably every menu there of all the restaurants but growing up I didn't like fish like I didn't like fishiness and then by the time I realized it
Barry Conrad
Ah, here we go again.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, Barry does not like it when women say, say that bitch is bitchy.
Barry Conrad
It's fish, it's, it's, it's, can't taste chickadee or steaky.
Melanie Avalon
days of it fishy captures the like the negative aspects of the sea you know like the fishiness so I haven't had clams because I like didn't have fish stuff or seafood growing up and then I just never by the time I don't know by the time I was eating fish which I love I just wasn't like eating clams like they're just not they're not on the menu a lot I don't think they're on this I feel like they're gonna taste like a scallop but they're not scallops right so I don't know
Barry Conrad
It's very, very similar actually.
Melanie Avalon
Are they sweet like scallops?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, they're sweet. They're not better at all. They're really easy to eat. Really delicious. Same consistency. Really good.
Melanie Avalon
I would like to get those and hopefully I like them. And if not, you can have them.
Barry Conrad
Sounds good to me. What do you want?
Melanie Avalon
Oh, wait, wait. Oh, I miss carpaccio Ah backtrack. I don't want prosciutto anymore. I want carpaccio. I love carpaccio
Barry Conrad
I am going to go the calamari Marco. I love calamari so much. And also I'm going to go for the assorted baked clams. I just, they're delicious. They're so good.
Melanie Avalon
So I think we should get one order and I'll taste it.
Barry Conrad
I wonder how many you get.
Melanie Avalon
And then if we like it, we can get another one.
Barry Conrad
Get another one and you know and this is kind of a wild card which you won't be expecting me to say no but i'm also gonna get.
Melanie Avalon
Wait, wait, wait, can I guess? Well, there's one thing on here that would be like super wild card. Is this like super wild card?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, kind of. I've never actually ordered something like this before in all the episodes we've done.
Melanie Avalon
eggplant and zucchini. You got it. I know you so well.
Barry Conrad
You do, but the reason why I am choosing this eggplant, Mel, is this week I did an episode of banter with BC with my co-star, Kirsty Marillier, for Destiny, and it was presented in such a way that A, it didn't look like an eggplant, B, it tasted amazing. It's kind of, it was like two, imagine two rectangular type tubes on a plate, like marinated, like meaty, like not soft, like just really good, like really, really, really delicious.
At this place called Miss Pearl, it was so good, it was amazing, loved it.
Melanie Avalon
You know the problem with eggplant and zucchini, right? Like why I haven't is, wait, let me check if zucchini is. Let me pull up my app, FoodSense Guide Shameless Plug. For friends, if they're curious, if you get my FoodSense Guide, it is a comprehensive catalog of over 300 foods for 11 potentially problematic compounds.
Oh, okay, zucchini is not this. Okay, that's cool. Eggplant, though, is a nightshade.
Barry Conrad
So explain why that would be bad for me, or bad for you, I should say.
Melanie Avalon
I don't want to like add any sort of food fear. So if you're not feeling, if you're not having issues with it, just don't even think about it.
Some people though have problems with nightshades and they contain a compound called, I think it's called, let's see, I'm literally looking in my app. So the compound is called, it's the family solanacea and there's a compound in nightshades that people, if they struggle with them, they might get like an inflammatory response, arthritis, things like that. So common nightshades are, eggplant is a big one, tomatoes, potatoes, paprika, goji berries, bell peppers, sweet peppers. So if you notice that you react to those foods, you might have a problem with nightshades.
Barry Conrad
So, Mel, can I just say something that's going to be really good for me to say? Paprika, tomatoes, potatoes, what do those things have in common? Me, I love them so much and I eat them so often, like on the daily.
Melanie Avalon
and you don't react to them that you're aware of. No. Yeah, so you must be good with nightshades. Me for you. I would be curious if you stopped eating all of them if you notice anything.
Barry Conrad
That's so interesting because I think I was raised with a lot of potatoes and a lot of tomatoes. I don't know if that's an epigenetic kind of a situation or even just like a conditioning situation, but yeah, I don't have a problem with them, I guess.
Melanie Avalon
Well, that's good. So all the eggplant and zucchini for you. And I don't know how to say the word, scap, scap. We've, if we know one thing is that we butcher language on this show.
Barry Conrad
Didn't you say someone said, it's so funny trying to hear you and Barry?
Melanie Avalon
Oh yeah, they liked it. That made me happy.
Somebody in the Facebook group commented on us trying to pronounce things and I don't remember which area of the geography world we were trying to pronounce, but we did it really poorly.
Barry Conrad
We're not gonna guess it, but it was, yeah, it wasn't great.
Melanie Avalon
But she said she liked it. This is eggplant and zucchini.
Barry Conrad
I want to say, I could be wrong. Please don't come for me guys. I'm trying.
Melanie Avalon
Okay. Are you going to get a super salad? I can read that. It says zupa e insalate. I don't know. It means soup and salad, right?
Barry Conrad
Yeah. I think I'm going to get... Oh, actually, I do like a good minestrone, actually.
Melanie Avalon
Okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna pass
Barry Conrad
You're like, okay, yeah. Okay, what would you like to get from the macaroni?
Melanie Avalon
Okay, I feel like now is where we enter entree territory entree slash main territory because there's macaroni so like pasta options there's pesky so the fish options oh I see what I want and the carny. Okay, and then it's like sides okay I see one of I see on this menu Barry one of my favorite meals to order at restaurants ever and I get so excited when they have it so we're in a good spot right now.
Barry Conrad
That's really good. What's catching your eye? Tell me. I want to know what it is.
Melanie Avalon
I mean, you can completely get rid of one whole category, so that helps. I don't think you know. I don't know if I've talked about this on the show.
Barry Conrad
I feel like you're going to get rid of the macaroni one.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, so no pasta.
Barry Conrad
And if you haven't talked about this on the show.
Melanie Avalon
It's something from the fish department.
Barry Conrad
Okay, let me think about this.
Melanie Avalon
And I can I give you a hint. I feel like a reason I love this dish is because it makes me feel very like ancestral and it's like a whole experience and I feel very primal eating this.
Barry Conrad
Ahol, Bronzino.
Melanie Avalon
Yes.
Barry Conrad
Yes, I got it right.
Melanie Avalon
I love whole brands, you know, it's like one of my favorite things.
Barry Conrad
Describe it for me.
Melanie Avalon
So have you had branzino? I have not.
Oh my goodness. So it is, I'm pretty sure it's lower mercury. It's this delectable, delicious white fish and they normally serve it whole. So there's like the, like the whole thing is there like the head and everything. And it's, it's just like, I was going to say moist. No, I'm kidding. I'm kidding.
Barry Conrad
Now that you know that's bad.
Melanie Avalon
Now you don't like it. Okay. It's very luscious. Is that okay? Luscious? Is that word okay?
Barry Conrad
Succulent, luscious, delicious.
Melanie Avalon
luscious, delicious, like this white meat, also still kind of lean. And you get it in the whole fish form. So you get to like, like I said, feel, feel like primal. And you know, if the, if the head is there, you can like eat the brain.
Barry Conrad
You eat the brain.
Melanie Avalon
If you want if the head is there
Barry Conrad
You're very surprising to me sometimes, Mel, because I know that you, because you listeners, you probably heard us talk about this before, like how we'd eat, you know, in front of people. And Mel was like, you want to take little bites and kind of like, she's like, I wouldn't cover my mouth, but I mean, this is like, um, this is a primal experience. You'd be using this like bones and the whole thing and eating the brain. I just can't picture it.
I'm trying to, I'm trying to picture you navigating this dish.
Melanie Avalon
I feel like I feel like we need to, yeah, we need to go to a restaurant where I can get order this because we can go here. We can go to carbon.
I like that you called it carbon. Isn't it carbon? Has an E at the end. I did say carbon, didn't I? Are they like carbon? Maybe, I don't know. Your accent kind of like changes it around. But yes, I love the whole, and I know, I know, I'm pretty sure I've talked about this. Like Barry, when you're back in New York, you can go to Whole Foods and you can get a whole branzino at Whole Foods and you can cook it.
Barry Conrad
Is Bronzino there?
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, yeah, yeah. They'll debone it for you.
Barry Conrad
Oh my gosh, it's all happening.
Melanie Avalon
at the fish counter for free, and then you can cook it. And so it'll still be the whole brands, you know, like it'll still have the skin, the head, the eyes, I don't eat the eyes, but they'll have everything but it won't have the bones because the bones are where it gets tricky because you're like eating and then you literally impale your mouth. It's a vibe.
So that's why I feel about whole brands, you know, so I'm getting that. And I probably want some meat too. But is there a fish that you want?
Barry Conrad
Well, the way that you describe me that is pretty good, but I'm not going to get the same thing. So I reckon I'm going to go for the Lobster Fratia Volo.
I love Lobster, so I reckon I'll go for that baby and then for sure.
Melanie Avalon
What fraud Diablo is like so do we know what that means Barry and I do this show so we can get educated on Like what things mean on menus? Oh It's like it looks like a pasta
Barry Conrad
like a pasta, I'm not mad at that. I mean, I would have that.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, it has a tomato sauce berry. This is your dish. This is your dish.
Barry Conrad
It's my dish.
Melanie Avalon
This is like literally your dish though
Barry Conrad
It actually is, yeah, I definitely get that. And then what about from the Carney menu, Mel?
Melanie Avalon
Okay, so this looks so good. I would like... Oh.
Barry Conrad
It's so funny. Oh, it's like a new processing. So it's like
Melanie Avalon
I was kind of craving a filet and they don't have a filet, so, oh my goodness. Wait, we should get the prime porterhouse for two. Then we can just like cover the meat section and we'll be like, good.
And a porter, wait, a porterhouse has a filet. What am I thinking? Duh. The strip and a filet. So, but how are we going to get it cooked?
Barry Conrad
See, this is where we might be at odds because you're going to want to blue, blue, blue, blue, and I'm going to want to maybe like medium rare.
Melanie Avalon
medium rare. What if we what if we do like rare plus, which is like in between rare and medium rare.
Barry Conrad
I've never heard that before. Okay, we can do rare plus.
Melanie Avalon
If you feel more comfortable with medium rare, we can do medium rare. That's fine.
Barry Conrad
I can definitely do rare plus for sure, but then I also feel like if we're doing that, I would love to get a different meat as well as a second option in addition like a chicken or a veal situation.
Melanie Avalon
It's a real parmesan.
Barry Conrad
Yeah.
Melanie Avalon
They have a pork chop and peppers, peppers.
Barry Conrad
Oh my God, you know, this place looks really good. I'm
Melanie Avalon
Realizing Italy is definition of nightshades, that's what I'm realizing. It's like peppers, tomato, eggplant.
And to clarify, black pepper is not a nightshade, just pepper peppers, like, you know, peppers.
Barry Conrad
I know what you're saying. You call peppers, we call it, it's not called peppers in Australia, capsicum. We call it capsicum.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, oh, you call like pepper spice capsicum?
Barry Conrad
I think that, is pork chop and peppers, is peppers meant to be like... I'm guessing it's pe-
Melanie Avalon
pepper. So like, okay, so pepper, like pepper singular is like spice. But if it says peppers, that's going to be like, you know, peppers.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, like capsicum.
Melanie Avalon
Oh wait. So capsicum is a pepper pepper. What? I'm like so confused. Okay. So capsicum for you guys is the full thing. Like not the spice. The full thing. Okay. That's helpful.
What is a ribeye Diana? I thought it, I did think I thought it was Diane. They call it Diana, but it's really good. Steak. Diane is pan fried beef steak with a sauce made from the pan juices.
Barry Conrad
Delicious. That looks good.
Melanie Avalon
Okay, so what do we settle on to the Porterhouse rare plus, which is like really annoying to the servers. I'm so sorry in advance and
Barry Conrad
And then we can get the, cause I feel like the robot and Diana, Diana is this, it's still a steak steak. So I feel like we're not going to do the papers.
Cause that's like a nightshade, right? So we're going to do, let's do the veal parmesan.
Melanie Avalon
You can get that it's on the side and this is for you because I got well, I've got the brands, you know We've got the lobster. Oh my goodness
Barry Conrad
we got so much. Can you imagine our table? When we actually finally eat, it's going to be so much food.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, it's going to be like, we know we probably should do, we probably should just go to somewhere like Texas State Brazil, you know, where you just eat the meat, you know what I'm talking about? Like the Brazilian state houses.
Barry Conrad
Yes, do they have that? Is that a big thing in the states? Because I know it is here.
Melanie Avalon
Mm-hmm. Yeah, Fogo de Ciao, Texas-Dade, Brazil are the two like big chains that do it, but there's a lot of, you know, restaurants that do it.
Just like, actually, I don't know if there's a lot, but it actually, it's like a thing a la carte as well. And I haven't been forever and I kind of want to go to one.
Barry Conrad
I think that would solve our problem of animal protein, like of not having enough.
Melanie Avalon
Yes, let me get this. Okay, do we want a side?
Barry Conrad
Yes. Well, for me, I diff, I would love some potatoes. And then I think that you don't like, do you like broccoli or not? Really?
Melanie Avalon
I mean, I yes, it's spicy, though. And I mean, I mean, if it's, you know, I like it. As my mom would say, I like it, it doesn't like me as much. My mom says that all the time.
Barry Conrad
Like about food, I guess.
Melanie Avalon
Like, I love this, or I like this, it doesn't like me.
Barry Conrad
That's funny. Probably just the potatoes. I reckon that's it. What about you?
Melanie Avalon
You know, I'll pass, we'll eat more meat.
Barry Conrad
Dessert looks good. This place looks so good. I love it What's catching your eye
Melanie Avalon
I'm going to get, so for my dessert, if I liked the clams, you know, we had at the beginning, I'll get another order of clams. I'll probably, though, get like carpaccio or something for dessert.
Barry Conrad
That sounds good.
Melanie Avalon
or like salmon or Dover. No, no, it's bicata, nevermind. Salmon or I will revisit whatever I really liked from before.
Barry Conrad
Mm-hmm. I will definitely get the chocolate raspberry cake as well as the tiramisu.
Melanie Avalon
That's what I was going to guess. I was like, he's either going to, yep, yep, yep, yep. If I were to get one and like have it, but not have it, it would be the carrot cake.
Barry Conrad
Really?
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, do you like carrot cake?
Barry Conrad
I do like carrot cake. I do actually. I would definitely have that.
You know, we played a game last episode about, you know, would that, is it eating window worthy? Carrot cake is eating window worthy for me. I would definitely have that.
Melanie Avalon
but you didn't order it as your two things. So it's not as worthy as chocolate raspberry cake and tiramisu. Which tiramisu I do not like. This is where we diverge. I can't do like the coffee vibe.
Barry Conrad
That's so interesting because you like coffee.
Melanie Avalon
Well, I mean, yes, not in dessert, though.
Barry Conrad
Not to eat it, you don't want to eat your coffee, you want to drink it.
Melanie Avalon
I have never like so like whenever I see like a dessert or any food that has coffee integrated into it no interest it's like conflicting because coffee is like a drink that you have in the morning and like wake up and conquer the day you don't want it in a like a food.
Barry Conrad
That's like an affogato. We've talked about this as well.
Do you remember what that is? No. It's like a affogato. It's like picture like a glass with like a shot of chocolate liqueur over like ice cream. It's really delicious. It's delicious.
Melanie Avalon
No. How about the drinks? I bet they have really good wine here.
Barry Conrad
So I've clicked on the drinks part, not the wine part, and then there's actually wine and cocktails on that list.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, perfect. Okay.
Barry Conrad
I like the font of this place too, it looks, it really gives off a vibe, like this place looks really good.
Melanie Avalon
I know you know what I'm thinking right now, because we're currently trying to finish our design for my glow coffee and I really like the font. I think this might be a good font for our bags.
Barry Conrad
That's good. Is anything, there's a few drinks there.
Melanie Avalon
Okay, so basically their list is so expansive that I feel very confident I can find something. It's going to require, I'm going to have to like research and look them up, see if they're organic, see if they're low alcohol, but I know I can find something definitely by the bottle.
Barry Conrad
Do you know what? I feel like we should do considering what we've just ordered, like thinking about the food options you've just had.
We should definitely get a bottle of white and a bottle of red, and then I'm going to get a cocktail as well.
Melanie Avalon
Perfect.
Barry Conrad
Do you know what I mean?
Melanie Avalon
Yes, I do. So when we go, I will do a lot of research and I will find the perfect bottles that are, are you good with like the organic low alcohol situation with the wines?
Barry Conrad
I'm sure that I'll be good with consuming it, but if I'm being really honest, I have not actively sought out. Let me find out the best. I try to always get the most high quality one, but I'm definitely not as versed as you in the organic go-to's.
Melanie Avalon
So hear me out. I really feel like the organic wines are the most high quality because they are doing the, they're like creating wine the way it's supposed to be created, like from the earth, all natural, exposed to the elements, not spraying it with all these chemical compounds.
So like, it's kind of interesting to me that there are so many wines that are really high priced and yet they do these modern, you know, pesticide situations that just like don't, I don't know, I think if you want like high quality, organic, biodynamic is the way to go, and then preferably lower alcohol if you want to, like, if you're like me.
Barry Conrad
Select what, like 10% or something? Is that?
Melanie Avalon
So I like to cap it at 12.5%.
Barry Conrad
So it's still, yeah, okay.
Melanie Avalon
Ideally, it would be 11.5. Ideally, it would be like in the 11s, 11s or 12s.
Barry Conrad
Interesting, so it's pretty yeah, okay, all right
Melanie Avalon
So like the whole low alcohol wine is not, I'm not talking about like de-alkalized like soup. I'm talking just like not 14% basically or 15%.
Okay. We should get a Pinot Grigio white. That's what we should get. Yeah, definitely. So we will get an organic Pinot Grigio and then we'll find a red and then what will you get for your cocktail?
Barry Conrad
I think because we're at this, I usually like to get a margarita, but I think because in the theme of being in at Cabo and I'm going to get a Manhattan and I have been having a few more of those.
Melanie Avalon
Perfect. Excellent, fine. I love the vibe and you should go and let me know how it is. Okay.
Well, this was so, so amazing. Friends, listeners, we hope you enjoyed traveling with us today. The show notes for today's episode will be at ifpodcast.com slash episode 441. They will have a full transcript as well as links to everything that we talked about. So definitely check that out. If you would like to submit your own questions for the show, you can email questions at ifpodcast.com or you can go to ifpodcast.com and submit questions there. And you can follow us on Instagram. We are ifpodcast. I am Melanie Avalon. Barry is Barry underscore Conrad. Yeah, I think that's all the things. Anything else from you, Barry?
Barry Conrad
No, thank you so much again for tuning in. We really appreciate you. Have an amazing week, and we'll see you next time.
Melanie Avalon
I will talk to you next week.
Barry Conrad
Talk to you next week. Bye.
Melanie Avalon
Thank you so much for listening to the Intermittent Fasting podcast. Please remember, everything we discussed on this show does not constitute medical advice, and no patient-doctor relationship is formed.
If you enjoyed the show, please consider writing a review on iTunes. We couldn't do this without our amazing team. Editing by podcast doctors, show notes and artwork by Brianna Joyner, and original theme composed by Leland Cox and recomposed by Steve Saunders. See you next week!