Welcome to Episode 453 of The Intermittent Fasting Podcast, hosted by Melanie Avalon, biohacker, founder of AvalonX, and author of What When Wine Diet: Lose Weight And Feel Great With Paleo-Style Meals, Intermittent Fasting, And Wine, and Barry Conrad, actor, singer-songwriter, and creator and host of Banter with BC.
SHOW NOTES
SPONSORS & DISCOUNTS
HYPERLIGHT
Hyperlight goes way beyond typical blue light blockers and are a daily essential for modern life! Not only do they help regulate circadian rhythm and reduce eye strain and fatigue, they actually transform harmful junk light from screens and artificial lighting into beneficial light. Hyperlight Optics uses patented Swiss nanophotonic technology with Fullerene C60, which acts as a quantum light transformer. This biocompatible light supports physiological balance by optimally energizing biological structures at the cellular level. They come in myriad designs, and also look SUPER cool. (Prepare yourself for people to ask you where you got your glasses. 
) Get 10% off with code Melanie10X at ifpodcast.com/hyperlight
LMNT
LMNT just launched a brand-new 8-count sample pack with their most popular flavors - perfect for summer hydration! This zero-sugar electrolyte drink supports energy and wellness during hot-weather activities like hiking and workouts, without the junk in typical sports drinks. Ideal for keto, paleo, whole food diets, and intermittent fasting. Get your free Sample Pack with any LMNT purchase at drinklmnt.com/ifpodcast.
LINKS
Featured Restaurant: The Meat & Wine Co.
STUDIES
Regulation of mTORC1 by growth factors, energy status, amino acids and mechanical stimuli at a glance
If you enjoyed this episode, please consider leaving us a review in Apple Podcasts!
Original theme composed by Leland Cox, and recomposed by Steve Saunders.
Our content does not constitute an attempt to practice medicine and does not establish a doctor-patient relationship. Please consult a qualified healthcare provider for medical advice and answers to personal health questions.
TRANSCRIPT
(Note: This is generated by AI with 98% accuracy. However, any errors may cause unintended changes in meaning.)
Melanie Avalon
Welcome to Episode 453 of the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. If you want to burn fat, gain energy, and enhance your health by changing when you eat, not what you eat, with no calorie counting, then this show is for you.
I'm Melanie Avalon, biohacker, founder of AvalonX, and author of What, When, Wine. Lose weight and feel great with paleo-style meals, intermittent fasting, and wine. And I'm joined by my co-host, Barry Conrad, actor, singer-songwriter, and creator and host of Banter with B.C. For more on us, check out MelanieAvalon.com and BarryConradOfficial.com. You can submit questions for the show by emailing questions at iapodcast.com or by going to iapodcast.com. We would love to hear from you. Please remember, the thoughts and opinions on this show do not constitute medical advice or treatment. So pour yourself a mug of black coffee, a cup of tea, or even a glass of wine if it's that time, and get ready for the intermittent fasting podcast. Hi, everybody, and welcome. This is episode number 453 of the intermittent fasting podcast. I'm Melanie Avalon. I'm here with Barry Conrad. And Barry, let's see, this episode airs, oh my goodness, when this comes out, it will almost be Christmas. It will be December 22nd. So Merry Christmas.
Barry Conrad
That's crazy. Also, hey, listeners, hey, Mel, this is a moment. This is a few days. This airs a few days before my first official Christmas living here. So it's pretty big deal.
Melanie Avalon
It's gonna be so magical for you, I'm so excited.
Barry Conrad
I'm so excited.
Melanie Avalon
I'm excited to hear which Christmas carol you like the most with your new newfound experience of being in the cold during Christmas.
Barry Conrad
You know what? All the carols just make sense when it's a white Christmas, right?
Melanie Avalon
White Christmas, baby, it's cold outside, sleigh bells, whatever.
Barry Conrad
Do you have do you have a Christmas playlist when you oh, yes, you do
Melanie Avalon
Yes, yes, yes. I add to it every year.
So it's got all my favorites from like ever, because every year new singles come out by all the pop artists and stuff, so I add my favorite new singles every year to it. It's forever growing.
Barry Conrad
have, and you may not yet, do you have plans for the holidays yet?
Melanie Avalon
I'm seeing a lot of shows. I know that.
I'm seeing Christmas Canteen, Elf, Christmas Cirque du Soleil, one more Christmas-related thing. Probably a Christmas carol, and then I think one more. Oh, Transabrian Orchestra. That's five.
Barry Conrad
You, hands down, and I've told you this before, but listeners, I will share it with you. I think, Melanie, out of everyone that I know in my life, actually, truthfully, sees more shows than anyone else.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, that's wild to me. I know one person you see, I know somebody who sees more than me, my friend Sarah. She sees everything that I see and then some more.
Barry Conrad
I really like it because you're supporting the arts, you're getting out there and having fun, you're not just staying home. I like it. It's great.
Melanie Avalon
so fun. But to answer your question, I don't yeah, I'm not sure actually what the situation will be on Christmas because my parents are in Sanibel. I don't know. I don't think we'll find out.
I just don't I don't like the idea of being in Florida for Christmas. Like, that's so unless I'm in Disney World, I just don't I don't I don't know if I can do it.
Barry Conrad
Otherwise you'll just stay, I mean, you'll stay home and decorate and maybe host. Do you ever host or would you more go to someone's place? No, I don't host.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, so if I had like a house, well, what's funny is growing up, I was like the party hoster for like in middle school, high school with like the theme parties and like inviting all the people and like going all out. But now, no, I don't really have the space for it. So
Barry Conrad
I like how fast you was like, no, I don't know.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, no, I just know if I had the space, I completely would for sure. For sure. That tracks. Are you going to go home for Christmas?
Barry Conrad
I'm not I'm definitely not going back to New Zealand or Australia this year because this year I'm staying here now so got to do it got to stay and I'm happy about it going to actually. Rent renting a place upstate in New York just to get just to kind of really guarantee that why Christmas because it may or may not snow on the day who knows but this is gonna give it a bit more insurance so an amazing Airbnb already booked it's going to be epic it's like.
Cabernet but locks and massive and like just has like a spa pool outside even though it's gonna be freezing and I can't actually can't wait it's gonna be so much fun.
Melanie Avalon
That sounds so magical!
Barry Conrad
It's gonna be cr- I have to show- I have to send you photos now.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, no, please do. That's so cool. Would you host people there? You said it's big.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, we're going to have some friends and stuff like just three or four people, but just yeah, renting it together and just like having fun out there, having like a work Christmas.
Melanie Avalon
Oh my goodness. I'm jealous. You're gonna have a white Christmas.
Barry Conrad
Yo, I really, I really hope it's not like that's why we went going upstate, you know, just to make sure. Wow.
Melanie Avalon
You're doing it right, I applaud you. You gotta do it, you gotta do it. Go to Upstate New York for Christmas.
Barry Conrad
Come to upstate New York or just find like you gotta like get amongst to get with the the snow is falling.
Melanie Avalon
Maybe it maybe it'll snow here. A Christmas miracle. It has snowed on Christmas in my life. I think maybe like twice.
Here it usually snows like once each winter season and then like that's it. And that's it. Yeah, but it does get cold, which is nice.
Barry Conrad
Hmm, well, that's good. Well, I know that you like the cold, so that'll at least be something, right?
Melanie Avalon
Yes. Oh, I love it. I love it.
Barry Conrad
Do you have any special recipes you want to experiment cooking on Christmas? Or do you have any traditions that you have on Christmas, like drinks or anything like that?
Melanie Avalon
I always just eat my same thing I always eat, but I mean, we have traditions growing up, but I do love getting to... I feel like the holidays, it's when you're seeing people all the time. You're just going to things and drinking wine and having good cheer and everything's festive and there's kind of like in Halloween how everything is decorated. All the city gets decorated and all the restaurants put up stuff. I just love it. It's like such a good vibe.
Barry Conrad
It's my favorite time of year and I'm so excited.
Melanie Avalon
and you're gonna get to do it right. Not that you were doing it wrong. I know. But it's gonna, I promise you, it's gonna be more magical. I can't wait to hear your thoughts.
Barry Conrad
And I can't believe by the time this airs, people will be buying their last minute gifts or doing, you know, getting decorations. I don't know, it's gonna be such a magical time of year.
Melanie Avalon
Yep, I can't wait.
Barry Conrad
Thank you for taking time out of your day to listen, everyone.
Melanie Avalon
I know. Happy holidays. And oh, oh, speaking of, I'm hoping we're probably going to be launching my coffee line in January. That's the game plan. So hopefully that's right around the corner.
So hopefully, guys, you're on my email list for updates, which is now up. So if you go to glowcoffeeco.com, so glowcoffeeco.com, you can get on my email list there for updates. And we'll be releasing information about the lunch special, all the things. But this is going to be the perfect coffee that you want for the new year's when you're cold, because it will be organic, free of toxins and mold, very, very high in CGA content. That's how we sourced and found the beans. So CGA is the primary antioxidant in coffee that gives it so many of its health benefits. So we found beans that are naturally very high in CGA. And then we roast the beans to preserve the CGA, because depending on how you roast it, you can actually degrade that antioxidant potential. So this is going to be one of the highest antioxidant coffees, if not the highest antioxidant coffee that you can get. And it will just make you glow inside and out. And it tastes so good. It's so, so good. So that's my little plug. Go to glowcoffeeco.com.
Barry Conrad
That's so exciting, Melanie, and I love my coffee so much, and I cannot wait to try it.
Melanie Avalon
I know, you know, I can actually go ahead and send you, I haven't sent you a bag yet, right?
Barry Conrad
You haven't, but I won't be mad.
Melanie Avalon
I can yeah I can send you a bag because we have the beans now so it is so good so so good.
Barry Conrad
Is it is it beans and ground or just beans or?
Melanie Avalon
It's whole. Do you grind your own coffee or do you do ground?
Barry Conrad
I don't, but I definitely will get it ground.
Melanie Avalon
It's just so much, it's really important to me that it's whole beam because it's so much fresher when you grind it yourself, tastes fresher, tastes better, less degradation of the antioxidants and also less potential for mold to form because ground coffee is more likely to form mold. So that's why it's really important to me that it's ground.
And if you haven't ground coffee before, if you have not, yeah, I guess ground coffee yourself, it's really not hard friends. Like it's so easy. Like you can get a, on Amazon, you can get a grinder and it is, I can't even express how easy it is because I think people think it's intimidating, but it's not. You just like put the beans into the grinder, push it down and now you have ground coffee. So easy. Like it's literally one tiny extra step for so many benefits.
Barry Conrad
cannot wait.
Melanie Avalon
So yeah, anything new in your life before we jump into things?
Barry Conrad
Melanie, I am obsessed with the show at the moment, actually. It's called The Pit. Have you watched it?
Melanie Avalon
The pit? Yeah. No, what's it on?
Barry Conrad
It's on HBO, I'm pretty sure, but it's amazing. I don't know, are you queasy about asking this before? Are you queasy about like medical shows or anything like that?
Melanie Avalon
So like, it's like, let's just like literal, like here's the ER and here's surgery happening type.
Barry Conrad
Yeah.
Melanie Avalon
I don't like, so I don't over, I wouldn't not watch something because of it. I probably, I might look away.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, I mean, it's very graphic. The way they do it is amazing. It's incredible. Obviously, it's fiction. It's not like a documentary-type real show.
It's not real people, but it's incredible acting, amazing performances. It's kind of like a medical thriller meets psychological horror because it's like Grey's Anatomy. If Grey's Anatomy got locked into a haunted hospital after dark, it's gory in parts, but it's so well done. Really addictive. Yeah, just incredible.
Melanie Avalon
and it's a haunted hospital.
Barry Conrad
It's not, but it's just like there's so many crazy it just kind of reaffirms how much these doctors go through like we're living our lives and doing, you know, life is hard anyway, but doctors in the ER just it's a lot.
Melanie Avalon
I'm so in awe of nurses and doctors in the ER, it's like, I'm so grateful.
Barry Conrad
So grateful so it's it drives home that but also it's it's incredible as well because they save these lives and so it's it's heartwarming It's not just all gore but the gore is I don't know It's kind of you watch it and you kind of go like how have they done that to make it look like that? like so real
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, I probably would look away. Yeah, you can do a lot by looking away.
Barry Conrad
That's really funny.
Melanie Avalon
It's funny. So for gore, I look away for like horror. I plug my ears.
Barry Conrad
Oh, so you, because we've never actually talked about this before. I've actually never asked you, are you a queasy person when it comes to watching, you know, killing people or anything like that or gory scenes?
Melanie Avalon
Can I tell you a funny story? Have I told you my Patriot story? Obviously, you know the Patriot, like the Mel Gibson movie, which I love that movie. Do you like that movie?
Barry Conrad
Of course. And he's the man. He's such an amazing actor.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, he's incredible. So I was the tech girl. Actually, I was a lot of girls. I was a lot of things in high school, but one of my mini roles, I was the tech girl. So I did the sound booth and stuff for our chapel and all the auditorium stuff. I was running tech for it and things like that, which was great because it was so great. I got to hang out in the sound booth during all the chapels. I mean, it's just much more comfortable to be in a room and not be down there.
But in any case, so this was a middle school and I was obsessed with a Patriot and my history teacher wanted us to watch it. I don't know. I think she mentioned it. She was saying how she wished we could watch it, but it's rated R and we were in middle school. So I volunteered to edit it myself. And this was before, I don't know how I even did it, but I ran either the VHS or the DVD. I captured it. I ran the entire movie onto my computer. I captured it some really sketchy way, got it onto my computer and then I edited it. I took out the bad words. I took out like the really graphic stuff and then I put it back onto like something and then we watched within the entire like middle school watched it.
Barry Conrad
Oh my gosh, what the...
Melanie Avalon
Isn't that funny? Totally forgot about that.
Barry Conrad
What prompted that memory? What made you think about that?
Melanie Avalon
Because we were talking about Gory and I was thinking about what was my first memories of like Gory movies and some of the scenes in the Patriot really did a number on me.
Barry Conrad
I'm so impressed that you did that by the way, like how did you even know how to do that and what, how did, what did you use to do it? That's pretty impressive.
Melanie Avalon
The way I had to do it was so complicated. It's coming back to me now. I had to run it. I had to hook up my camcorder, my video camera to the TV, hook up my video camera to my computer, and somehow I was able to get it onto my computer. I don't know how I did it, to be honest, but I did.
I did. Tech girl. Yeah. And it was like a three-hour movie.
Barry Conrad
You said what you just went through the whole things like okay and just meticulously edit it.
Melanie Avalon
I took out all of the curse words I took out. Is there a sex scene? I might've taken that out if there is one. And then I took out, yeah, like the really gory stuff.
Barry Conrad
And how did you present it afterwards? It was like, hey, everyone, I know this movie is out before you jump to any conclusions or freak out. I've edited it so we can watch it.
Melanie Avalon
I don't remember the conversation leading up to it. I think I just volunteered to my history teacher. I think I was just like, you know, I can edit this for you if we want to, if you want us to watch it. And I think they were like, okay, anyone's funny.
This is what's funny. They just trusted me because I don't think they like watched. I think we watched it live. Like I think I brought it in, we just watched it. So they, I guess I just assumed I was going to edit it correctly.
Barry Conrad
That's amazing, actually. I'm like, look at you, tech girl.
Melanie Avalon
I had a lot of really random high school stories, so.
Barry Conrad
Be good listeners, you know, so Melanie the tech girl, what about the other things you said something else? You're like
Melanie Avalon
I was the honor council girl. I was like on the honor council. Did you have that at your school growing up? I think that's a,
Barry Conrad
American thing, what did you do for the honor council?
Melanie Avalon
It's wild. I don't think it's a good, I don't think, I don't think it's probably a good thing.
It's, it's like, there was like four of us and we would, we would see, quote, cases. So when, when, when students did things that they were in trouble for, they had to come talk to us. And then we had to decide their punishment. It's like Harry Potter.
Barry Conrad
even though you were in school.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, I mean there was teachers in there too, but they wanted like the student perspective.
Barry Conrad
That's so funny. Let's decide your fate.
Melanie Avalon
I would not let high schoolers determine the other high schoolers' fate. But in their defense, I mean, I don't know, it was like the students, we were the good kids in the council.
Barry Conrad
Did you, what was the worst thing that you, what was the worst punishment you gave, remember?
Melanie Avalon
I don't remember, to be honest. I don't think anybody was expelled or anything, but I think, I mean, I think there's probably definitely like, I don't remember.
Barry Conrad
I was a prefect. Do you have prefects here?
Melanie Avalon
That sounds like something, don't they have that in Harry Potter?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, I feel like it's, I don't know if it's the honor council, but it's like, yeah, you get like selected and you get like a badge and you wear it on your blazer and like, you know, it's, you gotta be like a high achiever and like good, like a role model and stuff. It's, it's a thing.
Melanie Avalon
you wear your badge around school.
Barry Conrad
You do, like a prefix, because we had uniforms like Harry Potter styles like school uniforms like that.
Melanie Avalon
We did too. Really? Yeah. We didn't have prefix though.
But I've heard that before. I've heard it in like, I think I read it bad about it, like in novels and stuff growing up. I probably would have been, I would, I definitely would have been a prefix.
Barry Conrad
Student, often a senior chosen by staff to act as a leader role model and help her for the school. They're responsible for upholding school rules, assisting teachers, supervising younger students.
And represent that. Yeah. That's exactly what we did.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, we would have been in the same, actually, I don't know if we would have been in the same. We probably would have been in similar circles.
Probably. Because you would have been in the honor classes and stuff, right?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, special badge, blazer, stripe or tie. Did you wear ties?
Melanie Avalon
Only in elementary school for PRPE uniform was horrendous. I did not like it.
Barry Conrad
I can't picture you wearing a tie, it's not really Melanie Avalon coated.
Melanie Avalon
Ever since I worked at Reese Crisp, Beverly Hills, and had to wear a tie, I think I told you this, like I was like, I'm never wearing a tie ever again. Like I'm not, I'm just not.
I feel bad for men, they're not comfortable.
Barry Conrad
Are you good at tying them though?
Melanie Avalon
I don't know. Do you lose that skill? I haven't, I mean it probably because I had to do it every, when I was working at Ruth's Criss, I had to do it from every most days.
Barry Conrad
Can you send me a photo of you wearing a tie back in those days?
Melanie Avalon
I don't know if I have one. Actually, I probably do. I think I have a headshot, because I think for one of my headshots, it was like the server look. I'll find it and maybe send it to you.
Depends what it looks like. But OK, should we jump into some pasting things?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, let's jump into some fasting.
Melanie Avalon
So I have a study to start us off with. I'm actually very excited about this study. It is called Social Influences on Eating. And it was published a while ago, June 2016, in Current Opinion and Behavioral Sciences. The idea here is basically they were looking at how much we eat is very intensely affected by social norms. So basically who's around us, what are the cues, what other behaviors do we see people modeling? we tend to eat accordingly to how others are acting. So some of the findings from the study were that we do this unconsciously. We model the eating behavior of others. And it can happen. It happens for sure when people are around, but people don't even have to be around for it to happen. So they did a study, for example, and they found that if there were empty wrappers, like in the environment, people would eat more because they were assuming that other people had eaten it. And then if there are advertisements that suggest that other people have eaten it or like it, then you're more likely to eat it or like it. And then it happens with everybody. So it happens with friends. It happens with strangers. Children do it a lot and they do it when they're young and they do it for both their parents and their friends. So we know that this starts happening pretty early on. It doesn't matter if you're hungry. It doesn't matter if you're dieting. It doesn't matter how old you are. It's still a very powerful effect.
That said, if we identify more strongly with the group, so if it is like a friend circle or a fitness community, we're even more likely to mirror them. And they've done some really interesting studies on like people's characteristics and how it affects it. So for women, so women who were low in impulsivity actually tended to model other behaviors, other eating people's behaviors more. Whereas women high in impulsivity didn't, but they said that that might be because they were just less attentive or they weren't noticing. So it might be that if you're more impulsive, you're just really not noticing as much what other people are doing. Or you could be just like eating faster or something. So that could be why. Kind of contrary to that, which you would think people who, in a study, people who had lower self-control were more likely to copy their peers. And then, let's see. So it's also socially rewarding. So eating by eating in and of itself is rewarding. But when we conform to other people's patterns, it becomes even more rewarding. So it makes, it increases, it literally increases the pleasure of the food. And at the same time, just eating with others in general actually makes food more pleasurable. So A, eating with others, food becomes more pleasurable. And then B, if we eat like the people around us, it becomes even more pleasurable. And then, okay, and then it can even, this is so interesting, because what they talk about at the end is they talk about how this might relate to obesity, the obesity epidemic, because it seems that obesity can almost be contagious in a way because of how we model each other.
Melanie Avalon
So essentially, if you are, if you're around a group of people who are overweight, you're more likely to become overweight as well. And, or if you are in a, this was interesting, something really interesting that they said at the end, was because we're more likely to eat more in a social situation, because that's what it's more likely gonna be, is that you're in a social situation and people are eating more, because that's like the current norm. Then what can happen is you make new friends, you eat more to model them in the beginning. And it's something that should be temporary because it's like a, it should be like a temporary thing to boost connection and like bond with the social group, but then it just becomes the, like the pattern of the relationship, and then it becomes like ingrained, and now you're always eating more around these people. And so they were saying that might be a reason, a reason that we have an obesity epidemic and people gaining weight is that it could be this like social influence that's happening.
The only like things when it changes a little bit is so like gender differences. Okay, this was fascinating. Although I think people might have guessed this. So in mixed sex groups, so men and women, women tend to eat less. And that might be because they're just, they're wanting to look like they're dieting, they want to appear restrained. That's like the social norm. And we've kind of talked about this on, I think a prior episode. Men tend to eat more in the group, in groups of mixed company of men and women. And that's possibly to signal strength or confidence. And then let's see. So what they propose the, some of the takeaways and what they propose practically applying this is maybe not, maybe another way of helping make positive change for people's weight, like in the world. It's not just focusing on what you're eating, it's also making it, making people aware that these social norms happen because if you can realize, like awareness is the first step for so many things. And so if you can be in a social situation and become aware, oh, like I'm feeling this need to eat more than I want to. or eat less than I want to, and being aware that that might be just because of this psychological thing that we do being around other people, it gives you more power to have more control of your food choices and make the decision whether or not you actually want to keep engaging in whatever you're doing. And it takes away the guilt because it makes you realize like, oh, this isn't really like a willpower thing right now. This is like my sociological, psychological brain's response to being in a social setting. And it's a completely natural desire. And like I said, so being just being aware can remove that guilt, it can help you intentionally engineer your social environment to be, you know, to be around people who respect fasting or people where you feel accepted because like the community is so huge. So especially when it comes to things like intermittent fasting, being with a community of either fasters or people who appreciate fasting can really, really help. And then let's see if there is one more thing.
Melanie Avalon
And then fasting can also really help because it can make you even more aware of this social queue that's happening. And like I keep saying, awareness is really key.
So yeah, what are your... Oh wait, and one last thing is portion sizes. Although I feel like now, because this study is pretty old, I feel like at the time they were definitely increasing. And I feel like they have been increasing. Although I think relatively recently portion sizes are kind of getting smaller. Like we talked about like shrinkflation or whatever it's called. And I think with Ozimpic and the GLP ones, people have been eating less. So I think that the norms are actually changing. And actually that could be like a part two paper that they could write now, which is that, like I just said, with like the Ozimpic and GLP ones, I think there's a shift now towards people eating less and losing weight. So I think it actually could fuel momentum for people getting out of this overeating situation because of cultural norms shifting. So yeah, what are your thoughts on this?
Barry Conrad
I think it's, well, this is such a fascinating study. It's so interesting.
Just like what you're sharing how, not that it's not in our control, but social norms just so strongly shape what we eat, right? Like just something that seems like a given situation. Like, you know, it's actually, it really does. And what you said about food tasting better in the company of others. That is so, that made me think of that. I'd really agree with that. You know, and enjoying the food more in the company of others. If everyone's ordering a salad, you're more likely to choose something healthy. If everyone's grabbing fries, you're more likely to go, oh, what the heck? I'll just have that. I've definitely seen that happen. And I've definitely also been the subject of that. Like, yeah, I'll have that. You'll have it and I'll have the same.
Melanie Avalon
I would be curious if kind of like with the mixed sex study where, you know, men tended to eat more in the presence of women and women tended to eat less in the presence of men. I wonder if that also extends to the pleasure thing. Like I wonder if women get less pleasure eating with others. If they're the type that feels pressured to eat less, I'd be really curious about that.
Barry Conrad
How do you feel when you're in a mixed group with men and women? Do you feel any different?
Melanie Avalon
Well for me, it's like really Any people because well it depends so if it's like if it's and I and this really does relate to the I think the fasting And the judgment and all of that So like if I'm with like my family where I feel like they know what I've been doing. I feel comfortable.
I Do probably enjoy the food more with them, but I think if I am in a but honestly normally I just don't eat but if I were like in a social situation with like people I don't know I Think I would be much more self-aware Especially if I well if I wasn't eating I'd be much more self-aware if I was eating I think I'd be more self-aware and I think I would enjoy it less. Yeah, I would
Barry Conrad
That's so interesting. I also like used to joke a lot.
I had this one ex-girlfriend who just wouldn't, and I've told you this as well. A lot of girls have done this. They just won't eat in front of me. They'll cover their mouths. It's so crazy. It's actually not crazy, I shouldn't say that.
Melanie Avalon
I cover my mouth. We talked about this.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, we talked about this, the study speaks to that perhaps then, like maybe they just feel unladyly.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, I mean, like, literally, that's kind of what the study said, because especially if you're, if women are more likely to eat less in the presence of men, it makes sense that you would also do these adaptive behaviors like cover your mouth or not wanting them looking at you or yeah, it like, it fits so well.
Barry Conrad
It's so crazy to me and also like how, when did this even start? And I wonder if these cues or, or if these effects, well, obviously they're different in different periods in history as well.
Like I wonder how the, what the social, the gender differences in social eating behavior was like 50 years ago, a hundred years ago, you know.
Melanie Avalon
So I think it actually kind of talks about that because it talks about actually pulled out a quote that was about that because it talks about how We've always had this mirroring behavior, but the norms change around So it says well it talks about how it does say that there's an increase in average portion size which has created new consumption norms and then it was saying something earlier about how they there used to be a Like it used to be different where the the focus was on eating less
Barry Conrad
It's interesting what you said about men eating more, perhaps in front of women, which I mean, I don't feel like I eat so much anyway. I don't feel like I eat even more around people, but I guess I could see that.
Melanie Avalon
So you don't have like an awareness of wanting to eat more to show like your, your manly hood and your strength.
Barry Conrad
manliness
Melanie Avalon
Yes, they also said some of this is unconscious like people think they don't have these things but they do
Barry Conrad
You know what, like probably, you know, like, oh, let me show you how much I can eat. Like, oh, Barry can eat a lot.
Like I do eat a lot anyway, but maybe it's like, let me show you how much I can eat. You know, I'm a man, so much I can eat.
Melanie Avalon
You're going to have to notice now, if you feel like you're doing that, you know, I found the quote, it says, it says, maybe inhibit inhibitory eating norms, such as the norm of not eating more than others have been relaxed. So that will resulting in greater responsiveness to environmental cues that promote eating. So that suggests if they've been relaxed, that suggests that they used to be that there used to be norms of that were more inhibitory. So I think it's definitely changed, you know, throughout history.
And I do think it's going back now though, with I noticed, you know, I was thinking about this actually, because the Victoria's Secret fashion show, this is random, but they canceled it, you know, for a while. And I just got an email that it's back this year. And I was like, I think this is related to the changing norms of society and body weight. Say more. Like, I think before the GLP ones, obesity was, I mean, it's still the norm, I think, but there wasn't an answer unless you really dieted or did intermittent fasting. I mean, there was an answer, like people could do intermittent fasting and diet and things like that. But it was really, really hard. And so a lot of people felt really stuck in their weight situation, just couldn't lose weight. And so I think rather than, rather than like look for solutions and focus on that, we tried to change the norms of society for what we are. And so we tried to cancel things that put lower body weights in a, even normal body weights in a good light, because we wanted to normalize being overweight, because people felt stuck. So the solution was, we'll just normalize being overweight, and that's like the thing. So we're going to cancel the Victoria's Secret fashion show. But then when GLP once came in, now people are losing weight left and right. So now we can go back to it being okay to be a normal weight or even underweight. Not that any of this should be okay or not okay or anything like that. I just, I think it's a big, I think it's a big societal thing. And I think it's changing now. You can feel however you feel about it, like for better or for worse. But I do think just like objectively it's changing.
Barry Conrad
I do agree with that. And I've actually said to people as well, I feel like I'm back in the 90s in terms of just the societal norms around weight. Now, the more I look at even social media or any sort of headlines, people are thinner all of a sudden. And I wonder if it's, I mean, it's not a coincidence with the rise of Zimpik and whatnot. It's just, yeah, it's not a coincidence.
And I do think that you're exactly right that the expectation, even things like, you know, getting a BBL or getting, you know, the voluptuous look was like really desired. You know, the Kardashians had that look and now just the media is all changing and people ascribe to that. They aspire to it. You know, they want to, it's just so wild. I also knew this would happen. I knew it.
Melanie Avalon
You knew it before GLP1s or you knew it once GLP1s came into the picture.
Barry Conrad
I just kind of feel like history always repeats in some way. I didn't know how it was going to happen or who was going to lead the charge, but obviously GLP ones has led the charge, I think.
Melanie Avalon
that's so interesting. I didn't see it coming at all.
I thought we were, I thought we were going to, I didn't, cause I didn't, I was unaware of GLP one like as even a concept. So before they happened, I didn't know if there was a drug out there. Well, I guess, I guess if I had thought about it and if I was like, Oh, maybe they'll make a drug someday that does make people lose weight. And if that's the case, I do think norms are going to change, but I just never saw it coming. So I just thought we were going to just keep getting more and more overweight and just keep normalizing it and keep, keep like shaming you. If you, that's what I didn't like about it was it was like you were shamed if you wanted to lose, like in the past you were shamed away in a way, if you wanted to lose weight, because then you weren't accepting yourself. But now I feel like you can because people actually are losing weight. So now it's the thing to do.
Barry Conrad
I think it, I think it's not what it's why behind it. I think if people wanting to lose weight out of shame or wanting to lose weight out of pressure is different to people wanting to lose weight to feel like the best versions of themselves, I think it's a very different thing, you know?
Melanie Avalon
Exactly. I feel so strongly about this and and that's why I was really sad when the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show got canceled because I love that show and I like looking at those women.
I think they're stunning like literally it was one of my favorite shows of the year and I and it's just because I actually really appreciate like the female form and so I Liked watching it and I liked looking at Victoria's Secret models and they canceled it and I was like, huh? That's really sad to me, but now it's like it's okay again Because because as a society we're losing weight. So now we can have a Victoria's Secret fashion show again
Barry Conrad
I didn't even know it was canceled and it's so crazy and not crazy because you're real right. Now that there are more options for people who can't ship those pounds if they don't want to, if they haven't done fasting or anything like that, it's just like, let me just take this medication and now, oh, I feel good now.
And now the media following suit, you know, it's such a big, it is, it is such a touchy and important conversation and it is, it's happening.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, it's really touchy for people because people feel like it's so easy to ascribe blame somewhere and guilt and shame rather than just be objective about things.
Barry Conrad
I also don't, it's also not wrong to, it's not wrong to be thinner. It's also not wrong to be bigger. It's just like, I don't know.
Melanie Avalon
and both can be unhealthy or healthy.
Barry Conrad
Absolutely. Both can differ, are and can be, and are healthy depending on what the situation is. And so I think it's, yeah, just think it's a complicated topic.
And also very interesting, like I love talking about this because it's like, what drives people to lose weight? What drives people to not want to lose the weight? Is it because of, I'm proud, like body positivity, whatever size I am, like all of those things, like, because that was the conversation for a long time as well. And I'm sure that's probably maybe why I'm guessing that's why they canceled the show, right? Like, because the new norm was more body pride and it doesn't matter what size you are. And I'm not too sure. I'm guessing.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, like health at every size. And it's like, if we're not, if you're having these, you know, thin models, then, you know, it's like anti the health at every size movement in a way.
But what's interesting is like, so if you think about the criteria for metabolic syndrome, which is a unhealthy problem, it's high fasting blood sugar, you know, blood pressure that's out of range, low HDL cholesterol, high triglycerides, and then waist circumference, which is like literally, you know, your, your size. And I find it really interesting that we, for the waist circumference piece, we like normalize that into that's healthy at any size. But we wouldn't do that for the other markers. Like we wouldn't be like triglycerides healthy at every size or blood pressure at healthy at every size, you know, it's just the one that presents physically to outward world that we tried to normalize as being, quote, healthy. It's a really fascinating topic.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, I 100% could talk about this like all night. I also do think, yeah, I mean, gosh, there's so much I think about this.
Melanie Avalon
I know. So how do we get on this L because of the study?
Barry Conrad
I also do think, Mel, I'm of the thought if it triggers you or makes you feel bad, you don't have to watch the Victoria's Secret fashion show. You don't have to watch it.
Melanie Avalon
100 percent. It's kind of like I interviewed Dr. Abby Murano recently. She has quite a few books, but she's a behavioral scientist. And one of the studies she talks about looked at social media and the effect of looking at like fitness models on social media and whether or not it had a negative or a positive effect on the viewer. And it had to do with how you interpreted it. So if people were motivated by it and saw it as inspiration, then it actually had like a net positive psychological effect. But if people, some people like would get defensive and see it as, I don't know what the word she used, but like it basically would be demotivating and make people upset. And then that means it would have like a negative effect on somebody, which is something I've like, I really appreciated that study, because I feel like we're often told like, oh, social media and like, looking at fitness models and stuff is always gonna have like a negative social effect on you or negative psychological effect.
But I know for me, like I have found it in the past, like motivating. Yeah, I think it's really like individual, but neither is wrong. Like how you view all of this, what you feel, what works for you, what doesn't, what, you know, you have your own experience and what you want to engage the content you want to engage in. So engage in what makes you feel good.
Barry Conrad
It's so fascinating because it is really, everything really is, it reminds me of something that my friend said to me when he came and went to BC and he said, we don't see the world as it is we see it as we are. And it's just the same thing.
Like, you know, if we see the world, it's going to be different the way we interpret it. It's not actually the reality.
Melanie Avalon
so true. It is so true.
And we know that we know there's this thing called the reticular activating system, and it determines what we see. And we see what we want to see. And we see what we are that this also this literally was the other conversation I had last week, it was with Courtney McDermott. She has a book called give yourself permission. And it was a really it was a really epic conversation. But one of the one of the things she talks about was what we see, it really is only like what we are is what we see.
Barry Conrad
Mm-hmm. I really want to read I really want to read that that sounds amazing
Melanie Avalon
It was really good. And the conversation with her on the podcast was really good, too. So, listener, stay tuned. That episode is coming out, I think, in January, so.
Barry Conrad
Oh my gosh, well this is a fascinating study, I'm still thinking about it, I probably will be thinking about it for a while.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, yay. I'm so glad you like it.
Barry Conrad
Love it.
Melanie Avalon
Yay. Should we do a quick fasting question before? I know we said last week we were going to continue with Teresa's, but maybe we could do this week, Nydia and Maris. Actually, we could do one of them. One of them. Okay.
So question from Nydia. She said, I had a carne asade bowl and I meant to ask if creatine breaks a fast. I usually work out in the morning, so I need to know if it does.
Barry Conrad
Well, hi, Nadia. I hope you have an awesome day and thank you for this question. And it is actually something that a lot of people do wonder about. Like, does, you know, do you break the fast by having creatine? Is it safe to take before morning workout? The short answer is no.
Pure creatine on its own doesn't break a fast. And let me explain. So creatine, it's actually one of the most researched supplements out there, actually. And I only, I actually only just started taking it last year, and it's actually great for muscle building. And it's naturally found in your body. Your muscle, your muscles sort of store it and use it as a quick source of energy, especially for like strength training or high intensity. It's not, it's not like a caffeine. It's not like a stimulant, like just coffee. It's more like a topping up of the fuel tank kind of thing. Nadia, so from a fasting standpoint, what breaks a fast, as you may or might not know, is anything that triggers that digestion or spikes your insulin. So pure creatine, I have to specify. Not with additives or any sugars or anything like that. Monohydrate doesn't do that because it has no calories, no carbs. It's not going to measure the insulin levels at all or take you out of that fasting state. So that means if you're taking it with, say, plain water nitty or black coffee before your workout, you're totally fine. Only time you need to watch that is if you're using a flavored or premixed version, which I personally would not use because some of those blends sneak in the sugars or artificial sweeteners that technically is going to break your fast. So I stick to unflavored creatine, monohydrate, nothing fancy, just the real deal. And timing-wise creatine, it's, as I said, it's not like an electrolyte or caffeine. So you don't have to hit it at a precise time necessarily because it works by saturating your muscles over time. So it's more consistency. And I usually would take mine not right before my workout, but I would take it in the morning fasted, of course. And I like to train fasted always. And you mentioned when you said something about your mornings, you mentioned you work out in the mornings here. I'm the same. I love working out fasted in the morning and training fasted just gives me this clear, locked in feeling that's really hard to beat. And creatine is going to fit into that routine perfectly because it's going to help maintain your lean muscle in the air and your strength, especially when you're fasting long term, since you're not getting constant flow of protein through the day. So with the bowl, great choice, by the way, that's the kind of meal that supports your training. So it's packed with protein, minerals and sodium. And it's a nice balanced meal to have after maybe your fasted workout. So I reckon as long as you're using that pure creatine again, with no sweeteners or additives, it's not going to break your fast. You can safely take it before, after training, whatever fits your situation. It's one of the few supplements that genuinely does work and plays real nice with fasting. So keep doing what you're doing, Lydia. What do you reckon, Mel?
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, so I love that. The only slight nuance I will add to it.
So it's interesting because when you hear creatine, it really, it sounds like an amino acid. So it sounds like leucine or methionine or glycine, like all these different amino acids, but it's actually not. It's just made from amino acids. So, and the reason that's important is amino acids are one of the most stimulating things of mTOR, which is our growth signaling pathway in our body. And it shuts off autophagy, which is something that people love doing fasting for. What's interesting is that the majority of the studies and the literature seems to indicate that creatine doesn't activate mTOR. That said, there have been, like I did find one study where it indicated that it might actually stimulate mTOR, which would make you think that maybe it breaks a fast, but then at the same time, there's literally studies showing the opposite that it might actually increase autophagy. My takeaway is that I think these are very unique states they're doing these studies in. It's probably not the same thing as like having some unflavored creatine in your normal life. Like they're looking at very specific mechanisms and they're probably doing dosing that is different than what you would be taking. And again, it's conflicting, like I found one saying that it stimulated mTOR and one saying that it stimulated autophagy. So I think from a practical standpoint, I think it's fine. Like I agree with everything Barry said. It's probably minimal or negligible. If you want to be like super, super sure of everything, then you could have pure unflavored creatine in your eating window. But if your focus is fasting, you're feeling good, it's working for you, I think it's fine to have it in your fasting window. How did you take it when you were taking it? When did you take it?
Barry Conrad
I would just mix it in water. I mean, it doesn't taste great.
Melanie Avalon
Or like when in your fast did you take it?
Barry Conrad
I would just take it first thing in the morning, like when I'd have my coffee, have my creatine, because I was experimenting with it and what I did find that I held into more water a little bit or I did feel bigger, but that's fine. It definitely helped me build muscle and it's also just a bit of a, I wouldn't call it a side effect, but yeah, I did hold into a bit more water.
I noticed that for sure. But I just take it first in the morning with or before my coffee, just mixed into some water or in my coffee. Didn't love it in the coffee though. So I had it in the water. I did try once like sprinkle it into some ground beef. It wasn't that great. That's not something that you have to like for flavor. You can't dress it up like a protein shake or something.
Melanie Avalon
So MD Logic, if you're looking for a creatine, they make a really great creatine. So you can check that out and you can get 10% off.
If you go to ifpodcast.com slash MD Logic, search for creatine and use the coupon code ifpodcast that will get you 10% off. They have a creatine powder that is completely pure. They have one with electrolytes, but let me look at the, so the creatine powder that they have no, you know, added ingredients. It's and it's the creatine monohydrate. Is that the form that you were saying Barry?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, definitely, yes.
Melanie Avalon
Awesome!
Barry Conrad
Awesome. Thanks for your question, Lydia.
Melanie Avalon
I know. Thank you.
Next week I think we'll talk about carnitine. I used to get those so confused before I knew what they both were. Creatine and carnitine.
Yeah. So awesome. All right. Shall we have our proverbial breaking of the fast moment?
Barry Conrad
I'm so ready for this proverbial breaking of the fast and I'm really excited about this restaurant, Melanie.
Melanie Avalon
okey-dokey. And friends, the purpose of this part of the show is because it's not just about the fasting, it's also the eating, which we talked a lot about eating on, I feel like this show was like the eating show. But yes, we just celebrate the eating window just as much as the fasting window.
So Barry, and each week we'd like to pick a restaurant to learn about it that we think is cool. And then we talk about what we would order if we were breaking our fast at that restaurant. So Barry, what did you pick this week?
Barry Conrad
I picked the Meat and Wine Co. in London, UK.
Melanie Avalon
The Meat and Wine Co.
Barry Conrad
Yep. Look, even just that title, I knew that you'd be excited about that.
Melanie Avalon
Uh-huh, sign me up.
Barry Conrad
So listeners, originally this was actually founded in South Africa, which is where I'm from, it brings its premium steakhouse roots and warm African hospitality to London. They've also got one in Sydney, so I've tried the one in Sydney, it's amazing.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, there's a few different ones. So we're doing the London one
Barry Conrad
London one, and they offer an amazing ala carte menu of expertly aged steaks, seafood, share plates, like think indulgent, total comfort with refined execution. The wine less Melanie is heavy on the South African gems with classics.
Hopefully you can find something that you like in there that it's designed to compliment that flame grill flavor and the vibe, which if it's anything like the one I've been to, it's sleek, modern, dark woods with some moody lighting, touch of African art, really luxurious, but without feeling stuffy, you know. So let's check out this menu.
Melanie Avalon
I have a quick question about lighting. I don't know if we've talked about this before.
Do you, if you like go to a social gathering, speaking of social gatherings, like a social gathering, I think we've talked about this, like in a location where you can control the lighting, like do you take over the lighting if it's not good? I do. I did that yesterday when we were carving pumpkins. I like, yeah, I was like, I have to fix this.
Barry Conrad
How did you, did you, like what do you say? Like what's your icebreaker or what's your method to do it? Can I change the lighting?
Melanie Avalon
Well, when I'm with family, I'm just like, do you mind if I change the lighting around? And then I just start doing it. It's kind of like all happens at once. I like ask for permission while doing it type thing. But you got to have like the warm lighting, you know, I can't do like cold, intense lighting.
Barry Conrad
It's got to be warm lighting and also not overhead lighting. It's got to be, uh, lighting is so important.
Melanie Avalon
like lamps and stuff.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah, just like really soft lighting. When people come into wherever I am, often they're like, are you like a vampire? Cause it's always lower light, it's never bright.
Melanie Avalon
I love low light.
And then also fun fact for friends, overhead lighting at night, it signals to our brain that it's earlier in the day, even if it's not that bright, but lighting from above, like the direction can mess up our melatonin production.
Barry Conrad
That's actually really interesting and it's good to know actually.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah. So, okay. So we're doing the, oh, there's a lot. There's Sydney, Melbourne. Are these in South Africa? Adelaide?
Barry Conrad
No, so AdLit is in Australia.
Melanie Avalon
Australia? What about Canberra?
Barry Conrad
Canberra, that's in Australia as well.
Melanie Avalon
What about purse?
Barry Conrad
Perth is in Australia, have a sent you the...
Melanie Avalon
and then London, okay.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, there you go. And we should go to the, make your way over to the main menu. There is all this, this is actually these entrees as well. Let's start with the entrees.
This place is amazing. Melanie, I knew that you'd like it though. Meat and wine.
Melanie Avalon
I am excited. So do I go to, I see a lot of menus. What do I click on?
Barry Conrad
Go to Entrez and they will start there and they will work away. Entrez main.
Melanie Avalon
So I see like a la carte and then I see like aged lunch set menus, drink list, wine list. Am I at the wrong place?
Let's go to the a la carte menu. I just want to see what the aged menu is. Okay. So it's, oh, it's like their list of aged steaks that they have. So that's kind of like an add-on. If we want an age steak, do you have thoughts on the aged steaks?
Barry Conrad
You know what I don't particularly? Do you?
Melanie Avalon
I, it's interesting because aging the steaks can actually increase the histamine production. So even if it tastes better, I would err on the side of not doing aged, but I'm not going to turn down like an aged steak.
Barry Conrad
Yeah.
Melanie Avalon
So, okay. Entrez, wait, wait, wait, wait. So, Entrez, is this like the appetizer?
Barry Conrad
Yes. So yes, it is. It's the starting situation. And there's several. There's so many things.
Melanie Avalon
Oh my goodness, we get to call it your terminology today because we have to honor the menu. This is why you picked this, so we could use the right.
Barry Conrad
Yes, the correct terminology.
Melanie Avalon
Okay, so friends, we're looking at entrees, but actually it's appetizer.
Barry Conrad
It's, oh my gosh. Okay. There's so many emails. Anything or several things catching you away.
Melanie Avalon
Okay, I think, well, I think I want Jack's Creek Wagyu Tartar, which comes with truffle, egg yolk cream, condiments, anchovy, aioli, parmesan, and crispy potato. I'll get all of that on the slide.
And then we still don't know if I like prawns, right? Because I haven't had them, but they're like shrimp. To me, they are.
Barry Conrad
I feel like I don't know what the difference is. I think it's just cold, yeah.
Melanie Avalon
Or maybe I wonder if over there if it is the same thing it's different here, I think
Barry Conrad
Because in Australia we call prawns, we don't call shrimp prawns, it's just prawns, but it's the same.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, so here, yeah, that's interesting that you call it all the same thing. So apparently prawns and shrimp are two different types of small crustaceans that look very similar. So shrimp is of the suborder Plaociamata, and prawns are of the suborder Dindrobanchiata. They have a slightly different gill structure and body shape. Flavor and texture, they practically taste the same. Most people can't tell them apart.
In the US, shrimp is used for almost everything. In the UK, you guys use prawns for everything. Oh, that's so funny. Okay, so we don't know what this is. I wonder if like, oh, so that's my question. We call it all shrimp, you call it all prawns. What are we actually eating?
Barry Conrad
I feel like, you know, I have, I have had shrimp and I have had prawns and they honestly taste the same to me. I think the difference is when I've had shrimp in America, it's just bigger.
Melanie Avalon
In the United States, shrimp is usually true shrimp. In the UK, prawns are usually, oh, usually cold water prawns, oh, which are biologically true shrimp, what? And then in Australia, oh, in Australia, it's one of the few places where prawn sometimes actually means a true prawn. So in Australia, you're probably getting prawns, in the UK, you're probably getting shrimp but you're probably calling it prawns, and in the US, you're probably getting shrimp and you're calling it shrimp, but anywhere, we might both call it shrimp or prawns.
That is fascinating. I just learned so much.
Barry Conrad
That is really fascinating.
Melanie Avalon
So on that note, I'll get some King Prawns plain with everything on the side with the butter and the African chili sauce and the coriander and the pata on the side. How about you?
Barry Conrad
I'm going to go also the Jack's Creek Wagyu Tata, because it looks delicious. Got to do my chili biltong, which is traditional South African air dried beef.
It's Melanie. It's so good. Biltong. So good. You need to try it.
Melanie Avalon
It has chili built built into it though, right? Like it's like
Barry Conrad
Yeah, it's chilly built. I mean, when you go to a biltong shop traditionally, there's plain, there's all sorts of flavors, but I've got to do the biltong.
I'm going to also get some King Prawns as well, actually. We're so similar. Yeah, we are. And then traditional budivore, so budivore will change your life.
Melanie Avalon
Oh, what is that?
Barry Conrad
It's like a sausage, but it's not. Sausage is too much of a plain word to call it buddha-vos, but it's basically like buddha-vos, like sausage. And it's so good. There's nothing better.
It's so good. So that freaking buddha-vos. So you have to try it because it's like a delicacy.
Melanie Avalon
You say it so like effortlessly. I would, I'm just like staring at the word. I'm like, I don't know how to bore war wars. Like, like it looks like bore or wars.
Barry Conrad
BUDDHAVOS
Melanie Avalon
Buddhivores? Yeah, that's pretty good. This is off to a good start.
And then we go to the main, which is this is the actual entree. I'm translating for the people. Okay, so there's mains, and then there's skewers. And then there's also that age. Oh, wait, there's also steak. So it's like multiple menus. Okay.
Barry Conrad
It's going to be a bit, one thing I know is if this were happening in reality, Mel, as always, we'll have a big table and the people would say, but it's just the two of you, I'm like, we know. We're going to order it for four or five people.
Melanie Avalon
and they're going to think that you're going to eat all of it, but I will be right there with you. And the trenches.
Okay, so what are you getting? I like that for the steak, they actually tell you if it's grain-fed or grass-fed.
Barry Conrad
That is really good. I do like that as well. There's a lot of options. I'm going to stay away from the age, but what are you going to, what are you going to get?
Melanie Avalon
Would you have anyways, or did I change your mind with a histamine?
Barry Conrad
You changed my mind with this, I mean.
Melanie Avalon
Oh man, oh man. I don't want to ruin your, you can, you know, I just don't like histamine. It doesn't do so well with me.
Okay. I'm going to go for, looks like they only have one grass-fed steak and it's not my favorite cut, which is ribeye. So I'm debating if I want to get the grass-fed ribeye or do I want to get like a grain-fed filet. I think I'm going to get, maybe I'll get the grass-fed ribeye and I'll just not, I don't like it to be too fatty. So I'll just eat like the low leaner part of it. So I think I'll get that and then, okay. So I see that they, no, I know what I'm doing. I'm just going to get that for now. You know what's sad? I see that they have, they have, oh wait, they have lamb skewers. I want to see if I can get lamb skewers. I need to figure out what it's marinated in, like what the situation is. Maybe if I can get it not marinated.
Barry Conrad
Mm, lamb, I love lamb so much.
Melanie Avalon
How about you? Have you had the skewers there? You said you've been right.
Barry Conrad
I've been, yeah, I have, it's actually really, really good. I can't remember if I've had lamb skews, but I've had the peri peri chicken and it's absolutely incredible.
And also a peri peri chicken is a very South African thing. So I'm going to get the peri peri chicken. Yeah, peri peri chicken skewers. It's good. That with also the grass fed ocean angus is born in the Rhubai and I'm going to have some, I'm going down to the sides here. I'm going to have some, ah, the truffle mac and cheese. Got to do that. And the roasted potato and it's a very hearty meal for me.
Melanie Avalon
So is roasted pumpkin a common side dish in South Africa?
Barry Conrad
I wouldn't say it's necessarily South African per se, but it's, yeah, you see a lot of pumpkin there, definitely.
Melanie Avalon
So not just seasonal. Here we pretty much just have it for Thanksgiving holidays. Right. Okay. But you guys have it more often.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, we do actually. Yeah, we grew up with a lot of pumpkin.
Melanie Avalon
And chips are, those are fries, right?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, it's so weird how chips are like thick cut fries if you want to picture that.
Melanie Avalon
Wait, was it? It was last episode that we talked about Meatloaf, right? Wait, so have you found anything else that is like that you've learned? No pressure if you haven't.
Barry Conrad
Not yet, but I'll report back for sure. I'm sure that I will. I'm sure I definitely, well, Thanksgiving, we've already passed Thanksgiving once this is, but I'll be having all kinds of new things.
Melanie Avalon
You got to keep a list like every time you come across something where you're like, this is, you know, wild like that this is what this is like this word, let me know so we can talk about it.
Barry Conrad
It's actually really exciting, actually, because it's just new discoveries.
Melanie Avalon
I know, I actually have like an article save of another article about Australian dishes that I was going to run by you. Okay.
Barry Conrad
You want any size?
Melanie Avalon
No. And then dessert? Yes.
Barry Conrad
Absolutely.
Melanie Avalon
So let us have a look.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, what's catching your eye?
Melanie Avalon
I know what I want. I'm going to ask if I can get some, because they have the salmon skewers, I want to see if they can give me some salmon for dessert. Like plain salmon, if they can like do that.
Barry Conrad
That sounds like a good situation to me. I am going to do, I don't think you're going to guess my choice this time.
Melanie Avalon
Really? Wait, let me try.
Barry Conrad
It's two, but it's not going to be what you think.
Melanie Avalon
You don't think I'm going to guess it? Is it? Well, they have a grand finale that has everything.
Barry Conrad
They do.
Melanie Avalon
but you're not gonna get that.
Barry Conrad
Yes, I have to get that.
Melanie Avalon
I win.
Barry Conrad
Cause what I was going to say was like if it was between the single ones, if I had to choose one, it would be
Melanie Avalon
Let me guess, let me guess, let me guess. You're gonna get the, okay, since you think I'm not gonna guess it, were you gonna get the pudding?
Barry Conrad
Because it's so that it's very stuff again.
Melanie Avalon
I was wondering. Okay. And then where are you going to get the fondant? The cheesecake. The cheesecake. Okay. I was between that. Okay. I was between those two.
Barry Conrad
But the Malva Pudding, it's very much like, yeah, it's just very nostalgic as well. It's pretty delicious. Really nice.
Melanie Avalon
What is Malva pudding? It says it comes with apricot, jam. Do you say apricot or apricot? I say apricot. I don't know why I just said apricot.
Barry Conrad
I was like, do you say apricot tomato tomato?
Melanie Avalon
I say apricot. Do you say pecan or pecan? Pecan. You say pecan?
Barry Conrad
We had this debate the other night at this grilled cheese, tomato soup, meatloaf night, and they were like, it's bakan, I'm like, what do you mean? It's pecan.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, it's pecan. That's why I say pecan. Wait, I have some more for you. Do you say scone or scone? Scone. You say scone?
Barry Conrad
Yes, but also this person was like an Australian who lived here for a few years and all of a sudden he's like, no, it's it's because I'm like, come on, bro, it's not because it's peak in.
Melanie Avalon
it's pecan pecan so it comes with apricot jam custard walnut tools i can't speak and then fior de latte gelato so what is what is malva pudding
Barry Conrad
So I need, it's hard, it's really hard to describe. I really would love for you to type it in, to look at a Google photo to see what I'm seeing. It's actually so good.
We had it during Destiny as well, because there was a South African, this business that were delivering food, it's actually so good. It looks simple, but it's really good.
Melanie Avalon
and has a cream sauce over it. I love cream sauces.
Barry Conrad
It's actually delicious, Melanie. It's so good.
Melanie Avalon
It looks like, I don't know what it looks like. It looks like something. It looks like bread pudding.
Barry Conrad
But it's so much better. Awesome.
Melanie Avalon
Okay, and then should we look at drinks? Let's look at drinks.
Barry Conrad
We have to.
Melanie Avalon
We should be doing the children's menu and picking like for like children so people can know what to get for their kids. Should we start doing that?
Barry Conrad
So, you know, I think it's going to be, I wonder if listeners let us know, do you, when, when you hear this part of the show, do you look up the menu and order with us or look at the menu with us? We'd love to know. That'd be fun.
Melanie Avalon
I'd be really curious. Like for the kids menu, they have a steak. I love that.
Barry Conrad
That's actually kind of funny. I don't know why I find that funny.
Melanie Avalon
like feeding the kid the steaks okay and then the drinks where where is that where is it oh they a lot of sauces too are you gonna get any of those
Barry Conrad
Peppercorn, peppercorn sauce in South Africa is all time.
Melanie Avalon
What's invisible sauce, is that a thing? I don't...
Barry Conrad
I've actually never tried that. I don't know what that is, but maybe it's just no sauce.
Melanie Avalon
for three dollars. We charge you. Where's the wine menu? Let's see.
Barry Conrad
So if you go to the tab on the side there, and you got a minute, one last.
Melanie Avalon
They got rosés. Barry is becoming a rosé lover.
Barry Conrad
I actually am becoming a brosé. It's really, it's really a...
Melanie Avalon
You're becoming, oh, did you come up with that word?
Barry Conrad
Prose.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah. Yeah, I guess. Brose. Did you say brose?
Barry Conrad
I said bros there, yeah, like for bros.
Melanie Avalon
We should, we should like, oh my God, wait, Barry, we should like, is that a thing? Is that a thing we should, don't tell anybody, we should like, we should do something with this, like social media. We should like make some content. Nothing's coming up when I Google it. We should think about this.
You could have a Rosé line and you could call it Rosé. And you could like completely remark it. Like Rosé has a branding problem for applying to men. You could like change that.
Barry Conrad
Oh my gosh. Because you know what? I've actually been saying it to people, I'm going to get some brosé.
Melanie Avalon
You've been saying brosé?
Barry Conrad
Yeah, and get some brosé.
Melanie Avalon
I'm like in total entrepreneur mode right now. I'm like, what can we do with this?
Barry Conrad
Okay. No, totally. No, because I have literally been thinking about that one, because I've just been saying it in jest. I'm going to get some brosé.
Melanie Avalon
It's brilliant. It's what it is
Barry Conrad
Well, I'm bookmarking this right now.
Melanie Avalon
Okay. So, and they have a, oh, look at this. Remember I was telling you about Coravin and you were not familiar. They have a red under Coravin. So they have like a list of wines that they provide via Coravin. Oh, wow.
It's probably like nicer wines that normally, normally they could not do by the glass, but they can because they use the Coravin. So I probably would get, do you see something you would get one of the bros at one of the bros days?
Barry Conrad
It's such a catchy word. Yes, I would get the I get a bottle of the Rock Angel Chateau Iqaland Rock Angel the Rock Angel. Yeah, if you go all the way down past sparkling
Melanie Avalon
Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Oh, by the bottle. Oh, sorry. Okay. Got it.
Bottle list. Okay. Got to do the bottle. I like, I don't know. It's funny. So I like, I don't know if we've talked about this. Like, do you prefer, so if you're at a restaurant, do you gravitate towards by the glass or by the bottle?
Barry Conrad
It depends. I usually start with a cocktail or two and then might as well just get a bottle because I'm going to get more than one glass of wine. I'm not going to change up when I'm going to drink wine.
Why not? I'll just get a bottle because between two people it's going to go.
Melanie Avalon
But what if you don't like it as much? That's the problem. And you can't taste it before. So that's another thing you have to know about me. I always taste the whites.
Barry Conrad
No, but don't they always come up to you and they'll give you a little bit to taste first before you can't do that?
Melanie Avalon
for the bottle? Well, oh, well, yeah, I mean, yes, but it's kind of like when you open the bottle, you know, if you order a bottle and they open and then you taste and you don't like it, then you're sending back, then they have to, it's like awkward.
Barry Conrad
I guess if you know what you like, I guess, you know, like, if you know I really want this, like, you know that you like a pinaiguzzi, you know you like a rosé, a brosé.
Melanie Avalon
I could probably, so if it's a situation where I'm getting by the bottle, if I have the wine list and I can research, I can probably, and I've done this before, I can pretty confidently order a wine. If it's a very large wine list, I can find a wine that I know I'm going to like by the bottle. But I have to be like very confident.
And it requires a very large wine list, but it can happen. But normally if it, normally I just go by the glass.
Barry Conrad
Or maybe I get like a glass and then if I like it then I'll get a bottle.
Melanie Avalon
works. I think I would get the just looking at it like very briefly and I would do some more some more research.
I know I should get a South African wine because because you know where we are I would have to look all look up all the South African wines because they tend to be heavier and higher alcohol so I'd have to research them but just looking like really briefly I like the looks of the Chateau, Courouin, Bordeaux, Cap Sav, Merlot, Cap Franc, Blint from France. But if I was going I would look up all of the South African wines and probably get one of those if I could find one.
Barry Conrad
This place just, it's very UNI coded, just meat and wine, lots of meat, lots of wine. Yeah, can't go wrong.
Melanie Avalon
Awesome. Do you ever get dessert wines?
Barry Conrad
You know what I actually do? Like I love, I do like a good limoncello.
Melanie Avalon
Usually, like. Wait, limoncello's not wine, is it? That's a spirit.
Barry Conrad
Yeah, I'm full that I like to drink though, but it's just a wine, let me chill out.
Melanie Avalon
Limoncello is a, um, like an inside joke of my family. So yeah, apparently there was a night, I wasn't there, but apparently there was a night where people had a lot of limoncello and we don't talk about limoncello anymore.
Barry Conrad
I know, but I do actually buy a Riesling, like I do like a good Riesling even without dessert just I'll have it in the fridge Riesling is really nice.
Melanie Avalon
Nice. The thing about Riesling is I feel like it's out of, if you had to pick one varietal that can vary like to an insanely vastly different amount for the amount of sweetness, it's Riesling. Like Riesling can be super sweet or can be bone dry. You never know what you're going to get.
Barry Conrad
Are you gonna... any of the dessert wines catching your eye or not really?
Melanie Avalon
No, because they're always so sweet. I feel like on my birthday, I always end up drinking dessert wines because it's like, it's your birthday, you have to have something. And so there's like, somehow a dessert wine ends up in front of me. I feel like this has happened for the past like three years.
I'm not about it, but I do it anyways. At that point, it's like whatever.
Barry Conrad
Let's have it.
Melanie Avalon
yeah so oh they have a oh wait let me wait sorry i have to look up this wine i might get this one by the bottle hold on let me just see one thing let me see if it's organic okay i might get yeah they have a chateau moulon avent gamay bougille from france that's really speaking to me i might get that by the bottle maybe
Barry Conrad
I'd like to try some of that.
Melanie Avalon
Yeah, that's one of my go-to's. Well, good find. Have you been multiple times to this?
Barry Conrad
I have been multiple times, not to the UK one, but I have been in Sydney, absolutely.
Melanie Avalon
They should open one here.
Barry Conrad
They really, I'm surprised there's not one here.
Melanie Avalon
I'm surprised too. We don't really have a, like, there's a lot of steak house, you know, nice steak house.
I don't want to cause like a chain, but like steak houses with multiple locations situations, but there's not one with this flare with South African vibes to it that I'm aware of.
Barry Conrad
I'm really surprised by that actually.
Melanie Avalon
I mean, closest we have, it's not South African, it's Australia, but we have Outback Steakhouse. Which, did they have that in Australia? Oh my goodness, that's so funny. Awesome, awesome. Well, good find, listeners.
We hope you enjoyed your time with us. I keep getting distracted because I keep seeing more wines. They have a sparkling Moet Echandon Grand Vintage Rose.
Barry Conrad
Oh, that looks really good. That sounds really good.
Melanie Avalon
We might have to start with the...
Barry Conrad
Yeah, that sounds delicious.
Melanie Avalon
now I'm back. Listeners, if you enjoyed today's show, feel free to submit your own questions to questions at ifodcast.com or you can go to ifpodcast.com and submit questions there. You can also submit restaurant ideas. We have featured before restaurants that got submitted by listeners, so feel free to do that as well.
For these show notes for today's show, you can go to ifpodcast.com slash episode 453. That will have links to everything that we talked about, so definitely check that out. You can get all of these stuff that we like at ifpodcast.com slash stuff we like. You can follow us on Instagram. We are ifpodcast. I am Melanie Avalon. Barry is Barry underscore Conrad. I think that's all the things. Anything from you before we go?
Barry Conrad
Thank you so much once again for tuning in everyone, have an amazing week and we'll catch you next time.
Melanie Avalon
Awesome. I will talk to you next week.
Barry Conrad
See you next week, bye!
Melanie Avalon
Bye! Thank you so much for listening to the Intermittent Fasting podcast. Please remember, everything we discussed on this show does not constitute medical advice, and no patient-doctor relationship is formed. If you enjoyed the show, please consider writing a review on iTunes.
We couldn't do this without our amazing team. Editing by podcast doctors, show notes and artwork by Brianna Joyner, and original theme composed by Leland Cox and recomposed by Steve Saunders. See you next week!