Welcome to Episode 462 of The Intermittent Fasting Podcast, hosted by Melanie Avalon, biohacker, founder of AvalonX, and author of What When Wine Diet: Lose Weight And Feel Great With Paleo-Style Meals, Intermittent Fasting, And Wine, and Barry Conrad, actor, singer-songwriter, and creator and host of Banter with BC. 

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TRANSCRIPT

(Note: This is generated by AI with 98% accuracy. However, any errors may cause unintended changes in meaning.)

Melanie Avalon
Welcome to Episode 462 of the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. If you want to burn fat, gain energy, and enhance your health by changing when you eat, not what you eat, with no calorie counting, then this show is for you.

I'm Melanie Avalon, biohacker, founder of AvalonX, and author of What, When, Wine. Lose weight and feel great with paleo-style meals, intermittent fasting, and wine. And I'm joined by my co-hosts, Barry Conrad, actor, singer-songwriter, and creator and host of Banter with B.C. For more on us, check out MelanieAvalon.com and BarryConradOfficial.com. You can submit questions for the show by emailing questions at iapodcast.com or by going to iapodcast.com. We would love to hear from you. Please remember, the thoughts and opinions on this show do not constitute medical advice or treatment. So pour yourself a mug of black coffee, a cup of tea, or even a glass of wine if it's that time, and get ready for the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. Hi, everybody, and welcome. This is episode number 462 of the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. I'm Melanie Avalon. I'm here with Barry Conrad. Barry, how are you today?

Barry Conrad
Melanie, I'm doing wonderful. I woke up to my first New York snowfall since moving here a few days ago.

Melanie Avalon
Oh my goodness, that's so magical.

Barry Conrad
It really was like, because I've been waiting and waiting and waiting is like, when is it going to snow? There's, you know, false advertising on the weather app and then it didn't happen.

Then it did happen. Then all of a sudden I got, I woke up the next morning and everything was covered in snow and it was snow wing. It's one of those things that I always thought about as a kid, like watching like home alone and dreaming a one day living here and, and experiencing it. But you know, seeing as you're the, you know, cryotherapy queen, what are your thoughts on snow? Do you like it? Do you like skiing? Do you like snowfall? Does it annoy you? Does it make you happy? Tell me.

Melanie Avalon
Well, so I'm trying to, so this airs February 23rd, it'll still be snowing then, right? Or when does snow? Yeah. Yeah, it's still cold. Okay, perfect. I realize I'm trying to keep things timely for the listeners.

I love the snow. It is so magical. I don't actually like being in it. Did I tell you about the, have we talked about this being in the snow and coming inside versus the rain? No. My friend and I had a long conversation, me and a few friends about this the other day. It's so interesting that if you go out in the snowstorm or in the snow and then you come back inside, you're not wet. Do we talk about this?

Barry Conrad
We didn't talk about this, but keep going.

Melanie Avalon
But it's still the same thing. It's still rain, it's just frozen. And compared to like, if you earn a rain, like if it's raining and you come inside, you're soaked.

Barry Conrad
That is true. Yeah, because it was snow and I was walking in the snow, and your hair's a bit wet or you have little bits on your coat, but you're not drenched at all. It's so crazy.

Melanie Avalon
Isn't that interesting? I thought about that for way too long. Where does the water go?

Barry Conrad
Yeah, well where does it go?

Melanie Avalon
I don't, now I'm thinking about it, I think it doesn't stick to you, maybe that's it. I guess like when it's raining, it immediately saturates like your skin in your clothing, but the snow doesn't maybe stick to you?

Barry Conrad
This is really okay now it's making me think about you know how Melanie you talk about how females need situations to be right before the go out and things change from the car to the.

Melanie Avalon
You're never gonna let that one go.

Barry Conrad
I'm not going to let it go, but now let's throw snow into the equation. Does it affect things that way or not really? Seeing as you say, you know.

Melanie Avalon
Okay. So say I'm meeting somebody for a date. I would much prefer it be snowing than raining. That's for sure. And then, but yes, it would definitely add, it would add time.

Barry Conrad
Buh-bye!

Melanie Avalon
Oh. Because it dishevels your body and your everything. I can't even express.

Okay, here's a question for you. Say you're going off to something and it's raining. To what level of upsetness or dread or like negative vibe does that add to you going to the event if it's raining?

Barry Conrad
It's not great if it's going to touch my body, like if it's going to actually hit me. If I'm inside or I'm going to have no contact with the rain, fine.

But if I'm in a suit or something like that, and it's like a red carpet situation, or even like just like a date or something, nah, come on. It's not going to be great.

Melanie Avalon
It's just like wild the amount of stress it adds to me. Like, I need to work on that like mindfulness-wise. It's just water, but it just like messes up everything.

Barry Conrad
But I can't. Okay, what do you do? How do you get when that happens? I'm trying to picture you.

Melanie Avalon
I bring an umbrella and then I like vocally complain to myself. Vocally complaining to myself helps a lot of situations.

Barry Conrad
Do you look grumpy when you're doing it? Do you kind of like smile when you're doing it? Like I just kind of picture you.

Melanie Avalon
I look like distressed.

Barry Conrad
I can't picture it.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, I'm like and I want people to know if they ever see me doing this or like if they see me outside and it's cold and I'm like Vocally complaining to myself. I'm very much like aware.

I'm not like actually complaining. I mean I am I'm doing it to like make myself feel better But I'm not actually I don't know if I'm I don't even know if I need to like explain this I want you to know that I'm very aware of what I'm doing and I'm aware that it's ridiculous And I don't mean it, but I do mean it

Barry Conrad
That's really funny. Well, you know yourself, which is important to shelves and to shelves. That's the main thing, right?

Melanie Avalon
Yes. But thankfully, because I went to three shows over the past four days, which is Barry Conrad style and not my forte, and it did not rain any of those.

Barry Conrad
How was that? How were the three shows?

Melanie Avalon
It was fantastic. They're all Christmas related.

No, one of them was Wizard of Oz, which was amazing to see. Like, that was my favorite movie when I was little. My favorite movie. Not an exaggeration. Like, my entire room was Wizard of Oz themed.

Barry Conrad
So when you saw Wicked when it came out ages ago, did you feel some kind of way when you saw the scarecrow and everyone or you know how they made an appearance in like Dorothy and everyone made an appearance in Wicked? Did you like seeing those characters? Did they?

Melanie Avalon
Yes. Wicked is like, I see it as... I think it's interesting how they handled the... I don't want to go on too much of a tangent, but they had to do a lot of work to... Because you want to be sympathetic to Elphaba, but also she's pretty horrible to Dorothy, and it's like, what's going on there? That's not nice.

And Dorothy is such a good character in Wizard of Oz. I was reading articles about this, actually. Apparently, in the opening scene, did you see this about... In the opening of the first movie, when they show them walking down the yellow brick road, Toto is on a leash. And he's never on a leash in The Wizard of Oz. And it's because they're trying to create this idea of Dorothy has the animal on a leash. So maybe that's another reason that Elphaba doesn't like Dorothy. But seeing Wizard of Oz was amazing, because I loved that movie growing up so much. Did you like it? What was your favorite childhood movie?

Barry Conrad
I liked, you know, like Indiana Jones and the Wizard of Oz. Yeah, it's classic, but it wasn't my favorite thing, but it's awesome. It's really great.

Melanie Avalon
You do know I like just recently, I mean, within the last, well, maybe last three years saw Indiana Jones. Really? Mm-hmm. I had seen like one of the new ones, but I like dedicated myself and I went and I watched all of them. you

Barry Conrad
Do you, was the reason why we didn't watch them like you don't like those sort of movies or did someone say you got to watch it or what made you want to watch it?

Melanie Avalon
I would put the responsibility here on my parents because I think they should have shown it to me, you know? Like, I don't know why it wasn't in the canon of stuff we watched.

Like we watched Star Wars, Star Trek, a lot of the other movies, but for some reason we never watched Indiana Jones. So I guess my dad wasn't, because he's a big movie person, I guess he was not, I don't know why we didn't watch it growing up. I feel like that was something I needed to have been shown.

Barry Conrad
I also love Back to the Future and stuff like that. And also like, obviously Home Alone and those movies is not as old as Wizard of Oz, which is like a classic, but I like Ninja Turtles, all the superhero stuff. That's my bag.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, we were not allowed to watch Ninja Turtles. I don't know. Is it violent? I don't know. My mom always had really I don't really understand some of like what was on the OK list and what wasn't.

Barry Conrad
It was not violent. That's not violent. I mean, there's fight scenes, but it's not, it's not like sore or like really gory. It's just really fun. You know?

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen any of it ever, I've seen the cereal.

Barry Conrad
I don't think you'd like it, but the cereal, that's funny.

Melanie Avalon
There's like always, isn't there like always a cereal, I feel.

Barry Conrad
There's a cereal and also like, I liked it to the point where my mom bought me, you could buy like the shell, like, you know, the turtle shell and put it over your shoulders, like a backpack.

Melanie Avalon
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's cool. That's, that's really cool. That's immersive.

Barry Conrad
That's very funny

Melanie Avalon
And I will say, if you ever want to feel less than confident about keeping up with the younger generation, just go walk down the cereal aisle. Like I don't know who any of the mascots are on cereal box, not mascots, like the people on the boxes. It's like, I don't know who that is.

Barry Conrad
Same. I had to say one more thing. Lion King. Lion King for days. I love the Lion King.

Melanie Avalon
Lion King is stunning. And talk about traumatic, Lion King is traumatic.

Barry Conrad
It actually is. It's a pretty full-on story.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, so good. Man, if I was in New York with you, I would have the amount of shows I would go to. I can't even think about it. It's too many.

I'm kind of glad I'm not. That would be overwhelming, I think.

Barry Conrad
Do you think that you'll come for a visit in 2026 to New York?

Melanie Avalon
You know what, I really need to. I need to see you, I need to see my friend Carmen, I have other friends there, I need to.

Barry Conrad
And then we can see a Broadway show while you're here too. What would we see?

I guess it depends what's on. And also like there's so many restaurants we featured in the podcast that we could try to track one of them down and go to one of those.

Melanie Avalon
I still kind of want my first time, though, to be watching you on Broadway.

Barry Conrad
That's very kind and very sweet and when that happens then then maybe that's the time.

Melanie Avalon
It's going to be so epic. I'm so excited.

Barry Conrad
Are you gonna do the front row?

Melanie Avalon
Oh, yeah, I know you don't like it, but sorry, I didn't say I don't like it. Well, you're not going to see me, so.

Barry Conrad
we can't see like you pretty much can't see anyone

Melanie Avalon
row.

Barry Conrad
Well, kind of. It's kind of blinding, but nothing beyond the front row. And it's all in and out, yeah.

Melanie Avalon
Right, that's why you have to be on the front row, because nothing beyond. Wait, this is actually kind of funny.

I think the odd, but you can usually see the front row. And I think people don't realize that because I, oh wait, really quick question. How do you feel about this, Barry? So I really, I need your, I, this is like, that sigh is very authentic. Like I really need your opinion here. I, are you, have you ever been in a situation where you're like at a show or something and somebody like gets on their phone during it?

Barry Conrad
Yes, it's so rude, actually.

Melanie Avalon
And what if it's the person you're with?

Barry Conrad
I would say put your phone away.

Melanie Avalon
You would, yeah, like that.

Barry Conrad
What's the relationship? Are you really good friends? Are you like a date?

Melanie Avalon
This has happened multiple times with people now, because I go to so many shows, they bring people. And so like the other day at a show, my friend was on the phone. And, but the thing that I was like, this is what I'm saying, like, I don't think, I mean, A, I don't think you should be on your phone, but I don't think people on the front row realize that they can actually like see you. So that's what I told her.

I was like, I was like, just by the way, you know, they can, they can see us.

Barry Conrad
And what does she say?

Melanie Avalon
She's like, what do you mean? Like she kind of like panicked for a second. She didn't really know what I was saying.

She's like, who? She's like, they're like security. I was like, no, I was like, no, the actors, like the actors couldn't see us. It was really awkward. I felt so awkward about it, but I couldn't not say something.

Barry Conrad
I honestly give you so much props for saying something because it's one of the most disrespectful things people can do, unless it's an emergency or something like that, it's a different thing. But if you're going to come to the theater, stay home if you're going to be on your phone because it's like we're pouring out everything on stage for the audience.

Melanie Avalon
But there's nothing worse I mean I know you don't like see you're not really looking at the audience as much but like for the actors that do look like to like look down and see somebody on their phone that would just take me out of it.

Barry Conrad
It's deflating.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's like one thing in movie theater, because the movie, the actors on screen can't see you, but I do think that's rude too.

But yeah, live theater, it just, but I literally was struggling with it so much because I thought it was going to be like a quick thing, but then this person was just on it, like ongoing. And so I spent probably like 10 or 15 minutes being like, do I say something? Do I not? And then I said something and then I felt horrible for saying something, but...

Barry Conrad
I'm so glad that you said something and, and listeners, I'm sure that all listeners already know this, but I'm glad that Melanie's putting it out there. It's just, and also like you actually do see people online calling out people like especially in storage to the person and on their phone, like, thanks for glad you had such a good time that like, you know, it's, it can make you feel like, ah, rejected cause you, you're pouring out your heart and someone's like bored.

It seems that way anyway.

Melanie Avalon
That's what it seems like, but they don't want to be there.

Barry Conrad
Also, okay, Melanie, even like in a movie, is it that hard to go like a couple hours just off your phone and just escape? You go to the movies in the theater to escape and to lose yourself and get lost in another world, right?

Melanie Avalon
Yeah and like I'm really happy to be talking about this right now and I would really be curious listener's thoughts on this because I don't know what to do because it really bothers me but I don't want to make it about me but I do think it's like a kind of like an understood thing that you shouldn't be on your phone at a movie theater for example. So it's like you I want to say something but I don't want to be like make it about me and I don't want to enforce my social standards on other people but I also don't want to sit there being resentful.

I don't know I struggle with this.

Barry Conrad
It's not, you're not making it about you. It's, it's just etiquette at the theater. You'd go to the theater to, you buy the ticket to watch the show. You don't buy the ticket to watch your phone.

You know, you do that at home and you're on your couch and just doing nothing or whatever, but at the theater, like it's so fun too. Otherwise it's, it's better just to go. You know what? I know someone who would love this so much more than I would, and I'd give them them the ticket that's more respectful.

Melanie Avalon
especially when people don't turn like the light down on the phone too and it's then you're like distracted from it but I get okay here's here's two situations I want to know if these are exceptions say you have what if it's like a mom with like a young kid at home and they need to make sure the babysitter is not texting

Barry Conrad
That's very different, but also it's like, I can imagine that's not going to be sitting there for minutes. You'll just quickly check and then turn it back off. That's very different.

Melanie Avalon
And the second one, this one, I don't agree with at all, but I feel like this is the other one where people will be checking. It's because they're like following a game that's playing and they need the updates.

Barry Conrad
No way. I mean, I love a game, but it's just like, you got to like pick your poison. Not that a show is poison, but just pick it and make your choice. Like stay home and watch the game and enjoy the game. Or else you're just going to be resenting the actors on stage for taking you away from your game as well. It's not as fun, you know?

Unless someone made them go like, my partner made me go, my wife made me go, my husband made me go to the show. I don't want to

Melanie Avalon
Okay, I feel I feel better. I still don't know. I still don't know that I know like what to actually I think I'm still gonna I think I'm always going to feel bad. I'm always going to like stress about saying something.

If I say something, I'm going to feel bad. If I don't say something, I'm going to feel bad. And there's no solution. People just get off your phones. That's the solution.

Barry Conrad
Okay, I'm going to give you three scenarios and you just have to answer off the top of your head if you can. And this is, it's the same exact question.

What would you say when the person pulls out their phone and not just for an emergency, they're on their phone and the three different people, the three different relationships? Okay, one, new date, go.

Melanie Avalon
Oh, okay. If it was like a first date situation, I wouldn't say anything and I would be really annoyed.

And that would be like A.M. was the word, like not a good like check in their favor for date number two.

Barry Conrad
Yeah. Second one is best friend.

Melanie Avalon
if it was like clearly a problem I would probably have a conversation with them after about it rather than during it unless they're just on it the whole time.

Barry Conrad
or like during intermission or something.

Melanie Avalon
Probably after.

Barry Conrad
Well, and then last but not least, a family member.

Melanie Avalon
That's the easiest to say something. Well, actually no immediate family. Yes.

Extended family probably goes back to second, the best friend situation. Like wait, talk about it later. Like immediate, immediate, immediate. I could, I could say something. Yeah.

Barry Conrad
That's so interesting.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, how about you?

Barry Conrad
I would probably, because apparently I'm not that subtle, what I want to say or something, but I think that I am, I'm being sleep, but I'm not. So I think I'd probably still somehow let them know and it's not quite subtle.

Maybe I'll be like, enjoying the show, like with a smile, you know, like a bit of a, that's like a day. Second one, if it's like a good made-up man's like, bro, or like, you know, hey, do you know what's the show that can see you? Like I'll say it with a smile, but it'd be like, you shouldn't be on your phone. And then the third one, I'll just be like, put your phone away.

Melanie Avalon
Here's here's a fourth situation. And I actually this is the only situation where I feel very confident in my approach. And I don't stress about it. The person next to you who you don't know.

Barry Conrad
I would say something. You would? Yep.

Melanie Avalon
I like look over at them, like so that I'm like obviously looking at them and then I do that, I just keep doing that.

Barry Conrad
Like look at them and then look down at their phone and look at them again. So I think, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Melanie Avalon
kind of like look over and look at their phone and that actually usually works. It usually works.

Barry Conrad
What if they say, can I help you? What do you want?

Melanie Avalon
Well, they don't usually because.

Barry Conrad
All these scenarios.

Melanie Avalon
I know, well, I had this the other day and then I swear we can move on, but I was seeing a show at the Fox and this is not a phone situation, but it was like a couple next to me and the woman had on like a, I think like a puffer jacket and the guy had his arm around her and he was like rubbing her shoulder, but the sound it made was like, if you can like rub a puffer jacket, like it was so loud. It was so loud that my friend on my right was looking over at them. It was obnoxious.

So we kept staring at them and then finally like the wife was like, honey, and she like, so that he would stop, but then he kept doing it for the rest of the show. It was literally the most annoying thing.

Barry Conrad
Why don't you take a puffer jacket off? You're inside.

Melanie Avalon
But I'm sometimes I'm like, shocking, I'm like shocked by people's complete lack of social awareness. Like, can we just be aware for a second?

Barry Conrad
I think people are just so, I think human beings in general are just very funny, complex people. Just, you never know what you're going to get out there in the wild.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, but then also you have to remember people have their own journeys. So I was hearing, I think I was reading this or hearing this the other day, like everybody, like when you have like conflict with people or whatever, in theory, everybody is doing what they think is the best thing based on the reality that they're in.

Barry Conrad
That's true.

Melanie Avalon
shall we now that we've made our PSA announcement about getting off your phones oh wait last situation what if I was doing it

Barry Conrad
Well, if you were doing it, well, you wouldn't do it. So that doesn't really count.

Melanie Avalon
I know, but what if I was? What would you do?

Barry Conrad
If you were on your phone and I could tell you, maybe you were waiting for a really important call or work email, I'll be like, is everything okay?

Melanie Avalon
I think that would be the line for either of us if you're doing it.

Barry Conrad
Because what you're really asking is you're going to be in your phone for much longer.

Melanie Avalon
So funny, okay, shall we jump into some fasting stuff?

Barry Conrad
Yes, let's do it.

Melanie Avalon
Okay, so actually do we want to do so I have a study I'm trying to say should we do this last time we did a listener question first Do you think we should do like a fasting question and then my study because my study is actually not fasting specifically

Barry Conrad
Should we do a listening question first then?

Melanie Avalon
And then we can do my study, which I'm very excited about because we have a game we can play with it, kind of. So our first question is from Catherine.

She says, I'm going to be starting marathon training soon. Are there any specific fasting methods that co-exist well? Also, I'm trying to do a 16-8 schedule and start eating at 10 a.m., but I'm really hungry before then. Should I change the hours?

Barry Conrad
Hmm, well, Catherine, first of all, huge, massive, ginormous respect for stepping into marathon training because that's no joke, it's a serious commitment. And the fact that you're already thinking, how can I align fasting, you know, how do I align fasting with it tells me you're approaching this in a really smart, self-aware way, talking about self-awareness. I love that you're asking these questions now because that beats waiting until you're exhausted and frustrated halfway through the plan.

So the short answer is, you know, yes, intermittent fasting and marathon training can absolutely 100% coexist. But the longer, more elaborate answer is that they coexist best when fasting is treated as a flexible framework. Not necessarily, you have to do this, have to do that. So, you know, endurance training, Catherine, it changes the conversation a bit because your body has real performance and recovery demands that we can't really avoid. So the goal isn't to see how long you can stay faster during something like this. The goal is to support your training and your recovery and long-term consistency while getting into the benefits of fasting.

So my own experience, I'm training, I'm not training for a marathon, but I'm training for a half marathon early next year.

Melanie Avalon
Yes, you are. When is that again?

Barry Conrad
That is, it's in the first quarter of next year and I'm, I got my new running socks and stuff today as well. It's very exciting.

My normal rhythm is usually around a 20 hour fast that works really well for me most days, but whenever I'm in a phase like of high physical demand, which I am now, even though it's on a treadmill all the time, cause it's cold outside, whether that's intense training blocks, you know, traveling or just schedule demands, I adjust it and that adjustment is not a step back. It's the reason why fasting is really, really sustainable for me. And the body is so incredibly intelligent in Catherine, but it also needs the fuel at the right time. So with your training, I reckon. Think of your fasting window as something that can expand and contract like depending on the day. So on your rest days or easy run days, fasting might feel amazing. You'll probably notice good fat adoption, steady energy, mental clarity on your longer, bigger run days, speed work days or the heavy, heavy miles. That's where being more flexible is going to matter because those sessions are going to, are going to place a bigger demand on your glycogen muscle repair and your nervous system and you can't avoid that. So let's talk about this hunger you're feeling before 10 AM on the 16 eight. So that's important info to know because it's not something to ignore or push through automatically. So hunger isn't a signal that you're failing anything. It's not a failure signal. It's feedback, especially when you're increasing training and your body might be actually saying, Hey Catherine, we need this fuel a bit earlier today. So there's nothing magical about a 10 AM window eating with it necessarily. So if shifting your window to eight or nine helps you train better, recover faster, feel less stressed, especially right now, that's a win. So consistency over these weeks and months, uh, is going to matter more than sticking with a specific rigid clock time. So it's 16 eight schedule that supports your training is going to be better than a 16 eight schedule that leaves you depleted and annoyed and resentful that you're doing this marathon. So if you're running early in the morning, Catherine, and you want to stay fasted, there are a lot of middle ground options. So black coffee works well for a lot of people, electrolytes, especially sodium can make a massive difference. Some people find even a small amount of MCT oil can help take the edge of hunger without disrupting the fast in a massive meaningful way. They're a tool. These are just little tools for specific for like marathon training rather than day to day, and you get to experiment. That's the beauty and see what you feel best on during the season. Another big piece here is what, what are you eating when you do open your window during marathon training? So during this training, you're eating window becomes your performance and recovery window. Protein is massive. It's huge. So, so are complex carbs, overall meal quality, micronutrients, making sure that top tier, so not just eating to be full, you're eating to repair that muscle, replace the glycogen, calm your nervous system.

Barry Conrad
And when that's all dialed in, Catherine fasting, the next case is going to likely feel dramatically easier, sleep and stress and other things. So it matters more than most people realize too, especially you're going to feel the pinch even more when you're, when you're pushing yourself like this. So poor sleep, plus fasting, plus endurance training. It's, it's a lot, you know, and it's a fast track to feeling ravenous if you're not listening to your body.

So when the sleep is solid though, and your stress is managed, your hunger hormones behave a lot better and that's just physiology. So should you change the hours? Maybe if you like, and that's completely okay. I have should, it should elevate your training, so not compete with your training. So you can always tighten the winner back up later during the later days or after the race, but think seasons, not forever or rules. So biggest thing I want you to hear is it's a tool, not a test that it's here to support your marathon journey. You can absolutely fast through this and just keep listening to your buddy and keep us in the loop with how you go as well. Mel, do you have any thoughts on this?

Melanie Avalon
so amazing and so comprehensive and you are gonna have to keep us in the loop as well since you're doing your half marathon training.

Barry Conrad
I'm probably going to be eating so much more too.

Melanie Avalon
Yes. Oh my goodness. So excited for you.

I will not be doing that. But I'm very excited for you. No, that was really amazing. And yeah, the really nice thing about fasting is that it really does prime you to be in a fat burning state and primes you to do endurance type stuff. So it's great. It's kind of like what Barry was saying, using it as this tool to create this great metabolic state that will support your endurance efforts and your marathon. But then when it actually comes down to the marathon and it comes down to the actual activity, you might need to be flexible and do a shorter fast or make sure you're fueling enough.

So it's more like the fasting, I think, has the power and you can do it longer in the days surrounding the training rather than like the actual doing of the event. I would check out, it came out a while ago, but I would check out Mark Sisson's book, Primal Endurance, because that is all about like being in a fat burning state on, that's like a low carb diet, but like a similar thing where you are, you're creating a metabolic state in your body that supports fat burning from the dietary choices that you're making. So I would check out that. I love all of Barry's recommendations about how to adjust accordingly. And yeah, definitely if you're really hungry with the current window, it's not working for you. Like you don't want to be ever white knuckling it or pushing through. I mean, it's one thing like right in the beginning when you first start fasting, just in general, if you're feeling hungry when you're, you know, trying to make it through your fast. But if it's an ongoing lifestyle that you're in now, and especially if you're adding in this activity level that's different than what you've been doing before, you want a fasting schedule that does not have you really hungry every, every time. So I would definitely either and or both adjust the fasting window accordingly so that you don't experience that hunger, or just making sure that you are eating enough the night before.

Because so much of our next day hunger has to do with what we ate the night before. So are you having enough calories? Are you having a good time? Definitely keep us updated. That is really exciting.

Barry Conrad
Super exciting.

Melanie Avalon
Awesome, awesome. Okay, shall we talk about the study that I found?

Barry Conrad
I can't wait.

Melanie Avalon
So, this study is called Winter Holidays and Their Impact on Eating Behavior, A Systematic Review. And I realize when this comes out in February that the holidays will be past us.

But what I find really interesting about this study and I think it's still applicable is it talks about the long-term ramifications of holiday eating and like if that extends into the new year or not and why that may be.

Barry Conrad
That sounds super interesting. Can't wait to get into it.

Melanie Avalon
So let's see, and it's published in Nutrients in 2023 of September. So it's very long and they go through all of the different factors that affect holiday weight gain and they talk about the stats of it.

So I'm gonna give like a high level overview of some of the findings, but then the fun little game I thought we could play is at the end, they make a long list of suggestions for how to mitigate or prevent holiday weight gain. And I thought we could go through them and see if we agree with them or not, like each one.

Barry Conrad
That sounds good to me. That sounds awesome.

Melanie Avalon
Yay, okay. So, some of the findings. In general, people, this, I don't know if this comes as a surprise or not. I guess maybe we like to think, oh, holiday weight gain isn't really a thing. It is.

Like, pretty much all the studies show that people gain weight over the holidays. So, like, for example, in 2016, they did a study. They looked at weight fluctuations of 2,924 participants from three countries over a 12-month period. They found that, let's see, oh, and of them, 34% were women, 24% were obese. So, the participants were consistently monitoring their weight. And there was a linear trend until the holiday period. And then at the holiday period, there was pretty consistent weight gain. So, 0.4% in the US, 0.6% in Germany, 0.5% in Japan. In Japan, there was another 0.3% increase during their golden week. What is golden week in Japan? Have you heard of that?

Barry Conrad
No, is it like one of the like a religious holiday or like a cultural?

Melanie Avalon
It is April to May. A cluster of four national holidays from late April to early May. They have Showa Day, Constitution Day, Greenery Day, and Children's Day, creating a major spring vacation period.

Learn something new every day. And then let's see. Oh, and so the study in particular, what they were really focusing on was the 10 days leading up to Christmas and the 10 days after Christmas. And that's where they saw those other percentages that I mentioned. And so what is also really interesting is that, and this was found in multiple different studies, but people who are overweight or obese tend to gain more during holiday experiences. And they also tend to lose it slower. So going into the holidays in like a state of fitness or metabolic health being a normal weight, you'll probably gain less weight than if you're overweight or obese, which I can circle back to my thoughts about fasting with this because I think it just speaks to how like having a daily lifestyle, like intermittent fasting that keeps you at healthy weight is going to be preventative for situations where you might have otherwise gained more. And then let me see. They have found, so one study did find that even though activity and calories are often involved obviously in weight gain and weight loss, the main cause of weight gain during holidays is not being more sedentary, it is calories. On Christmas, people can typically consume up to 6,000 calories on that day. And then, so the types of foods that we eat during the winter tend to be high sodium foods and fattier foods. So the fattier foods is probably adding to the higher calorie intake. And then this is something I was talking about last week that I said your study reminded me of. So there's a series of studies that talk about social influence on eating. And basically we tend to, people tend to model the behavior of the people that they are eating with. So if we're with people eating a large amount, we're more likely to eat a large amount compared to if we're alone. And just in general, we're more likely to eat more if we're in a group rather than alone. And so holidays are often a time of like gathering around food and like being with people. So that's all creating a situation where you're probably eating more. And then, okay, so there's a lot of data on themes that affect food intake. So proximity and visibility. So is it close to you? Can you see it? Which a lot of times, like family gathering situations with holiday food, it's like the food is all like out, on the table or it's all out. So that increases intake. If it looks attractive, that increases intake. So signals about whether or not your food has already been eaten affects intake. So for example, they did one where people ate more chicken wings and pistachios if there were not empty bones and empty shells around. Sorry, they ate more. Okay, so they ate more if they didn't see evidence that they had eaten it already. So like if you, I guess if you're like eating at a holiday gathering and you like leave the empty bones on your plate, you're probably gonna eat less than if you like throw them away.

Melanie Avalon
The size of the plates matter and the bowls. So there's something called the dull buff illusion. And it's an optical illusion. And it literally makes us see size of like judge, like judging food amount differently.

So basically, like if it's a larger plate or a bowl, we underestimate the amount of food. And then, okay, so with other, again, going back to the thing about the social effect, the effect of it is so strong that we are more likely to eat more with other people and we're more likely to eat unfamiliar things that we wouldn't normally eat if we're if we're with other people. Oh, okay, so there's something called the the out. And this is something that Barry, I think you and I have talked about, as far as like guilt surrounding eating and like eating for other people. So there tends to be altruistic indulgence is something that can happen. And it's eating, I don't know if there's a term for this, but it's eating with the altruistic motive of making other people feel comfortable and pleasant. It manifests as a quote, healthy causes guilt context. So basically when we're in a situation, we're making a food choice, we may be aware of how our healthy food choice can make other people feel guilty. And then that affects our choices. So it's like not eating what you wanna eat to be healthy because you don't want other people to feel bad, basically, which is like something I've been so aware of for a long time.

And it's interesting to see it discussed in this article. So like basically if you're going to like a family or like a holiday gathering and everybody's eating, you might not wanna eat healthy because you don't wanna make other people feel guilty, essentially. So basically they went through all of this stuff and they basically like concluded that there's a lot of factors during the holidays that encourage people to eat more and it makes sense that we gain weight. And then the ramifications, oh, and then people don't tend to, okay, so even though it's like not that much weight gain, like I said, being like 0.3%, 0.4%, 0.5%, in general, people don't tend to lose that. So like the weight, this is like an everyday average normal populations, the weight that you gain over the holidays, it's very likely and possible that you will keep that weight. Like so each year you're gonna gain like a little bit more, which is something that like, again, like another reason I just love intermittent fasting so much is I just feel like it puts your body into a, like a normal state where you are maintaining a healthy weight. And I don't, I used to stress about, this is like, makes me feel, I don't know, I'm having like so many flashbacks because I used to growing up stress about holiday weight gain and now I don't even think about it.

Melanie Avalon
It's like literally not even a thing to me. Like nothing, I don't, I have zero fear and I don't see any negative ramifications.

If anything, I usually like might lose weight during the holidays because of the, because of how cold it is because I'm still like eating the same, but like being exposed to lower ambient temperatures and like being in the cold, I feel actually supports a more healthy weight. But then what they do in this study is they give a lot of suggestions. So I wanna see if we agree with them or not. But before I do that, do you have thoughts on all of this?

Barry Conrad
I just think it's really interesting, like one thing that stood out in particular is that the weight gain, it isn't spread across all of winter. It's like actually like that really concentrated period, like that 10 days leading up and 10 days after. And it's not necessarily like a demonized day. Christmas day is like a bad day.

It's that build up and the come down. And then also that how much, just how powerful the social nature of eating is during the holidays, like in how much, you know, that when people do eat socially, yeah, wow, that it's not just food availability. It's like food plus connection sort of thing. And people feel bad, feel good, make different choices based on that. And yet, and also just how they don't fully lose the weight afterwards. Cause for me, I'm like, that's speaking from my own personal experience. But when I do indulge in the holidays, cause I always do and I allow myself to, I know that I eventually just drop it, but it's interesting that people incrementally will kind of just keep adding on, like, you know, like compounding of year after year, not really quite lose that way again too.

Melanie Avalon
I had like an in-real-time epiphany while I was saying that because in general, I think when people age, they do tend to gain weight over the years. And we talked about that really fascinating study barrier about how the metabolism doesn't actually slow down that much as we age.

So this makes me think that maybe for a lot of people that slow weight gain that happens like very, very slowly over the years, like you said, it's not necessarily happening the whole year. And it's not even happening the whole like winter. It's probably happening during this like concentrated holiday season each year.

Barry Conrad
That also kind of makes you go like during the rest of the year, which is substantially longer than the, you know, the 10 day coming down from that holiday period, how active are people? How are people eating?

You know, with its support? I don't know. It's just like, it seems like such a long time to not drop it, you know, but I totally make sense. It's just older people have more time on other people. That's why they're gaining it if that, you know, which makes sense.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, and yeah, and then you commented on it, but just to comment on your comment, it's just so interesting just how pervasive that the social effect is of being in a food-centric situation with a lot of people during holiday gatherings. And it's just so interesting all the factors that come into play. So you mimic what other people are eating, you don't eat maybe what you want to eat because of this guilt complex about not making people feel bad. It's just really, really interesting to me.

So they gave 10 tips and tricks to deal with this. So here we go. And I actually didn't read, I like skimmed it because then I was like, oh, we should just talk about this and see if we agree. So number one, they say that indulging in a special celebratory meal is unlikely to have a significant impact. So like one meal, not going to have that big of an impact on your overall health. But if you have multiple celebratory meals, it may be beneficial to adjust your other meals. So you could opt for a lighter evening meal, you could choose to consume smaller portions of food, or you could only have one course at a festival meal.

Barry Conrad
What do you think? Oh, man. Can I just throw in the intermittent fasting? Do I have to go with the options? If I'm going to have multiple celebratory meals, which sounds like a lot of fun, I would just maybe make them more moderate so I can enjoy them all rather than miss out. That's what I would personally do. What would you do?

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, it's interesting. So like, I have no interest ever and people have to find what works for them, but I have zero interest ever and, and in a moment, consciously restricting like, like consciously consuming less food. Like, that's, I don't like having, I want to keep eating if I'm eating.

This is why I love fasting. Because then you fast and then you can eat.

Barry Conrad
I thought the question was like, if you had to choose that, or like, or would you do any of those? Because if I wouldn't do any of them, but if I had to choose, I'll choose that one.

Melanie Avalon
I mean, I guess would you do any of these?

Barry Conrad
Oh no, I would just eat it.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, I would, yeah, because I would not do that. I would not opt for a lighter evening meal.

I would just, I find that too that like, if I eat more than I do normally in my eating window, I'll be less, naturally in my next eating window, I'll be less hungry. Like my body will like adjust. So I guess I do, actually I do the third one. Only one course at a festive meal. I guess that's what I do. I still do my one meal a day.

Barry Conrad
There you go. That still works for you.

Melanie Avalon
Number two, to complete a meal, whether you're dining out or at home, you could enjoy a cup of coffee or tea while others indulge in a dessert. Or you could choose to eat a green appetizer before the meal, like a salad that will help with your fiber intake, reduce your sweet tooth.

Or if you choose a dessert, it'll help with that. Okay, so basically like you could eat a salad before, or you could have coffee or tea while people are having dessert.

Barry Conrad
No, I'm having the dessert.

Melanie Avalon
I know that's a no-go for Barry. That works for me though, I'm gonna drink wine instead, which is caloric, but it's not actually like stored as fat, so I can like drink, I don't know, I drink wine instead.

Barry Conrad
Yeah, fair enough.

Melanie Avalon
And yeah, it never worked for me to eat the salad beforehand.

Barry Conrad
No, it's also boring. It feels like a punishment. Like if maybe this will fill me up and I won't want the dessert. You always want the dessert, even if you have to sell it.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, yeah. Okay, number three, if you're drinking alcohol at home, they say it's easy to lose track of your consumption. So make a conscious effort to track how much you're drinking, because drinks add extra calories.

Barry Conrad
But we're not endorsing alcoholism or drinking over drinking. And also, I will say that I'm not concerned when I'm having a drink at home. If I'm enjoying it, I'm enjoying it and I don't feel guilty about it.

So I don't really worry about the calories and it's not actually that much for wine. It's like 110 calories per glass. It's really not that much at all.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah. And that's what I was saying, like it is calories, but it's not food calories. So, and it's not going to be easily stored as fat, like alcohol doesn't really have that pathway. So, it's more about what you're eating with the drinks. For me, I just know it's so important that I know how much I can drink and feel good.

And I'm very conscious to drink dry wine, you know, dry farm wines, dry wine that doesn't have high sugar content, lower alcohol. And then I pretty much just know how much I can drink and feel good. This is more about feeling good, but I do think that yes, it can be easy to lose track of your consumption. I just try to make like very proactive decisions about what I'm drinking so that I can indulge more.

Barry Conrad
Make sure it's good quality, make sure it's good, you know, makes you feel good.

Melanie Avalon
Yes. And then four, explore alternative activities with loved ones. So instead of focusing completely on meals, you could suggest going for a winter walk together.

They did a study where participants received an email with a Christmas-themed physical activity every day to complete. And then they were rated on like a spectrum from easy elf, which was light intensity, moderate miss clause, moderate intensity, and strenuous Santa, vigorous activity. And that was to like give more physical activity and like ways for family members to bond.

Barry Conrad
Okay, so I would do family activities for sure. I would still add that to the feasting as well, but I wouldn't do it as a way to cut back from eating. I would just say it's important to do some activity because they're fun to do. I think that's still be really good.

Go out and see the lights, go out and see the neighborhood, have snow fights, and then you can come back and have a dessert or something or vice versa after you finish your meal. I'm all for it.

Melanie Avalon
So you know what's funny is I kind of do this and that I kind of see gatherings. I don't see it as a, and this is how, I mean, you and I are a little bit different here because I don't like over, like I don't, if I go to like a holiday gathering and there's like tons of food, I actually don't want to eat all that food. So I see like gatherings, not that you, I think we just, we have a little bit different approach to like food related activities. So I like in my head, I see it as an alternative activity. I don't even see it. So if there's like a Christmas like gathering, I don't see it as like a food gathering. I see it as like being with friends and family and talking or like seeing a show or, so to me I kind of do this subconsciously, if that makes sense.

Okay, number five. So many times during holidays, high calorie snacks are served between meals. So if you need a boost of energy between meals, opt for a salty snack that will not cause spikes in your glucose levels, like Greek yogurt, pecans, baby carrots, hummus, apple slices with cow's cheese. Well, this is ironic because well, within a written fasting, you're kind of getting rid of a lot of the snacking. Yeah, exactly.

Barry Conrad
I feel like pretty much all of these are like not that applicable because I just wouldn't I wouldn't really worry or stress about it at all because I'm not you know what I mean I'm not trying to mitigate anything I'm just sort of I have so much more freedom in my life because of fasting you know I mean so that when I do indulge I don't it's not what it's not going to stress or worry me at all like really you know what I mean so it's that's what's hard for me to what do you think?

Melanie Avalon
That's kind of like the takeaway here I think is that you could be doing fasting and then you don't have to like worry about any of this, you know, or some of it. I mean, I do like the alternative activities and things like that, but it takes care of so many.

It's like when you have a fasting window that works for you, you don't have to worry about doing all these little tips and tricks and hacks and like, how am I not gonna be hungry and how am I gonna keep my blood sugar stable and how am I gonna... You just do the fasting and then like live your life and have your eating window.

Barry Conrad
And also the reality is you're not going to be able to eat everything anyway because you're so tired, like you're way more in tune with when you feel full and you've had enough to eat. It's not like all of a sudden, let me just have everything here because you're just not going to feel like everything, but you can have a bit of everything if you want to, but you won't probably finish it all.

Do you know what I mean? So you don't have to stress. That's the beauty of it.

Melanie Avalon
So like, and I'm thinking now, do you want to save the next five for next week? And we could talk about them because we did, we did half of the tips.

The takeaway, yeah, that I just had reading this was, I don't know. It's interesting that they don't, they don't mention fasting. I don't think, but it just, just takes care of all of this in a way. So, okay. That'll be a teaser. So next week, if, unless it's a guest next week, but next week that we're on, we could do the next, we could do the next five.

Barry Conrad
We will.

Melanie Avalon
Okay perfect because there's five more tips and tricks which we can discuss. Alrighty so shall we have our proverbial breaking of the fast moment?

Barry Conrad
Let's do it. Oh my gosh, here we go. I've got to get my restaurant. I'm so excited about this restaurant.

Melanie Avalon
So, for listeners, the purpose of this part of the show is, I mean, it's appropriate timing because we just talked about all the different things that you can do surrounding eating habits. And the ironic thing is the actual eating part of your day every day is so, so important for your health.

A huge part of fasting because we get all of the nutrition and build up our bodies and all the things during the eating period. So, we love to pick out a restaurant and feature it and talk about what we would order. So, Barry, what restaurant do you have for us today?

Barry Conrad
So today's restaurant is called Clou Madure, and it is in London, UK, and why it's special, Mel, it's often called and cited as one of the most romantic restaurants in London, especially famous for it wait for it, Mel, enchanting flower draped indoor garden dining room that feels like a secret escape.

So you've got to look at that website, look at that, what you can see there, the ala carte menu has this French and spy cuisine designed to be paired with really good wine, and that wine list is really expensive, lots of burgundy, French classic wines, champagne, and all the wines that bring the DIE, delicious ratio energy.

Melanie Avalon
Oh my gosh, you remembered it. I'm so excited. I forgot about that. Oh, wait, no, destination. No, no, no, that was wrong. That was wrong. Destination restaurant energy.

Barry Conrad
Yeah, destination by strategy. And the vibe is intimate, dreamy, built for those, this is the moment.

Melanie Avalon
Okay, so I have to take back. You found a restaurant. I feel like you have found a lot of restaurants that have like a like a nature vibe to them. And you had one recently that I said was my favorite vibe yet that I've seen.

But this actually might be better because these lights and the and the plants inside it's lit up like a fairy garden.

Barry Conrad
Yeah, I thought that you liked that.

Melanie Avalon
I love it. Oh, I love it.

Barry Conrad
Yeah, it's pretty stunning looking.

Melanie Avalon
What would they do at Christmas?

Barry Conrad
Yeah. Just imagine what it's going to look like during Christmas.

I'd love to. And they have so many different menus, but let's go to the... They've got these tasty menus, pre-theater set menus, weekday menus, but let's go to the a la carte menu. So that's the top one, and it's meant to be delicious.

Melanie Avalon
Breathe, I cannot think of something I would rather do less than eat before seeing a show.

Barry Conrad
Yeah. I mean, you're going to feel sleepy. You just want to eat after the show.

Melanie Avalon
Okay, let all occur. Okay, so starters, good terminology.

Barry Conrad
Yeah. What is catching your eye there, Mel? There's quite a few amazing options.

Melanie Avalon
We talked about this before. What's a terrine? It's a minced meat in a loaf, served cold in slices, like a pate, but chunky or more rustic. Okay, that's really cool.

I wonder if it has, if it's just the meat or does it have like, bread in it? Because they have, they have one, they have a classic terrine of duck, pork and guinea fowl, and crouté, with a house relish. Oh, what does that mean?

Barry Conrad
Yeah, well, I don't think that this onkru usually means it's like crusty. Like, you know, when you have like salmon onkru, it's usually like a, there's something in there to hold it together. Like maybe a bread or like a bit of pastry in there. But that all sounds really good.

Like that combination of duck pork and guinea fowl. I haven't had guinea fowl, that sounds good to me.

Melanie Avalon
That looks, it can contain flour as a binder, but it's not required. They might use eggs or cream. Okay, so if it's gluten-free and there's no flour, I don't want a lot of it, but if you want to get it, I want a taste. Of course.

I definitely want, so maybe for the table, and then I definitely want steak tartare with pickled onion, chamomile mushroom, chive crumb, smoked dressing. It's laughable, Barry, how much we love fine dining and how pretty bad we are at pronouncing everything. So definitely steak tartare. I love steak tartare.

Barry Conrad
I knew you'd go for that.

Melanie Avalon
How about you?

Barry Conrad
I'm going to also, so we're going to have the tareen of duck, that's just for the table anyway, so I'm going to have the tart of dulcet crab that looks really good, I'm going to have that as well as the steak tart tart, because I think that sounds delicious, so those two and the little sample of the tareen.

Melanie Avalon
And what does the crab come with?

Barry Conrad
So the crab is, it's a fondant of English apple lemon verbena. It just sounds really refreshing somehow and not that heavy.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, we are off to a good start. This is a good menu. OK, main courses.

Barry Conrad
Here we go. I can see something that you might like already, I can see it.

Melanie Avalon
I know what's funny is that so they have a they have a grass-fed Angus beef chop, cote de buff. Whenever it says like serves two, I'm like that's like the meal I would I need because like I need meals made of meat that serve two.

That said, I think I want the venison. Is that what you thought I was gonna say? Yes, I knew it. Yes. So saddle of, oh goodness, den bigshire venison. Simply roast it with ruskop onion, cream spinach, and morello cherry. What is saddle of? Do you know? Saddle of venison. Okay, so it's it's a premium cut. It's the tender loin and the tender loin. That's confusing. Like it's the loin that is tender and the tender loin. Oh, okay, that's cool. I definitely want that. It's like a circular situation. Okay, I definitely want that prepared as rare as they will give it to me with everything. I mean, I don't really if they can just give me some like steamed spinach. Yes, if I can get it with just steamed spinach, that would be great.

Barry Conrad
Amazing. And are we going to get, do you think we'll get the, well, I reckon we should get the grilled grass fed Angus beef chop just for the table. Oh, for sure. Yeah.

And then my two main courses will be the Cornish fillet of cod on a casserole of mussels. I love mussels so much. Cocoa beans and sea vegetables. And then also I would love to have the roast Sutton Hoo chicken, because I love chicken. Scottish porcini, grilled Salsify, mushroom sauce. I love mushrooms. So, so that sounds delicious. This place is great.

Melanie Avalon
This is so good. How are we going to get and I love that it's grass-fed. How are we gonna get the grilled grass-fed Angus beef chop?

Barry Conrad
We're going to do medium rare at least. I know that you're like blue.

I know you're going to do one blue, but we've got to compromise somewhere. I mean, what's the middle ground of blue and medium rare?

Melanie Avalon
Oh, wait, wait, medium rare, like medium rare or cooked more or medium rare. Wait, what does the at least mean? So some medium rare is like sounds like we're getting medium rare.

Barry Conrad
Yeah, or like, yeah, medium-rare is good, alright, you can do that.

Melanie Avalon
I mean, technically the middle point of blue and medium rare would be rare, but I will not force that upon you. I can do medium rare.

I can... I can do it. If you will let us get everything on the side with it.

Barry Conrad
For sure. That sounds great.

Melanie Avalon
Perfect. Maybe they can cook it like half and half.

Barry Conrad
Maybe. Also, do you like the look of any of the signs?

Melanie Avalon
I'll just have if they had the steam spinach. How about you?

Barry Conrad
I like the idea of carrots, honey and mustard because that's something I've never seen before.

Melanie Avalon
I thought you were going to say that. Yeah, really? I thought you were going to say that because you're going to say that it looks unique. It looks unique.

Barry Conrad
Yeah, I think it just sounds interesting, so I'll try that.

Melanie Avalon
Oh my goodness, okay. And then dessert, a la carte. Oh, they have, they've got a cheese plate.

Barry Conrad
Looking at it now. See, this dessert menu is also amazing. Wow, okay. What's catching your eye, Melanie Evelyn?

Melanie Avalon
Well I will be getting a repeat of something from dinner. I'll probably get more steak tartare.

The thing about that is like that's easy for them. Well unless they shut down that like I feel like that's easier for them to bring out you know at the end for dessert. So I'll probably get more tartare. Yes what would you wait can I guess what you want?

Barry Conrad
There's three things that i'm gonna get because one is not gonna be as big it's sort of like it's fun.

Melanie Avalon
Okay, well, you're definitely getting the Clos Magoré 70% Nicaraguan, I can't even say that word and I know that word, chocolate souffle, right, New Jersey milk ice cream? Yes.

Please allow 15 minutes. Are you going to do the pairing that comes with it?

Barry Conrad
I'll do the pairing that comes with it.

Melanie Avalon
which is the Circeal Tenure Henrique and Henrique's Madeira Portugal port. And then you're going to get the, I'm confused because you said it's small.

Barry Conrad
There's two, maybe it's not small, maybe in my header I'm justifying it. There's two things, one of them is two more things, but one of them is probably going to be quite small. It's fine.

Melanie Avalon
What is classic Rambaba? What is that?

Barry Conrad
I don't know, but I'm going to get the selection of cheeses because I love a cheese board.

Melanie Avalon
Are you getting three, five, or seven? Seven.

Barry Conrad
Of course. And then the handmade chocolates, because they're little 20 pieces, and I think that's the small thing. It's like small little cute pieces of chocolates, fine.

Melanie Avalon
Wait, where is that? Oh, I didn't even see that. Okay. In a special presentation box, 20 pieces. That's not small. That's like an entire, that's like an advent calendar almost.

Barry Conrad
Because I'm like not did you like I'm just like classifying each piece because each piece is small so that's more

Melanie Avalon
yeah that's misleading. oh my gosh oh wait okay i'm not timely at all but do you do advent calendars at all?

Barry Conrad
You know what, I sadly have not done that, but I really kind of feel like a missed out because it's like it's such a thing that so many people say they grew up with.

Melanie Avalon
Do they do that in Australia?

Barry Conrad
They do do it, but I just I never really grew up with ebony calendars, but I really feel like I've missed out on that. Yeah

Melanie Avalon
I feel like now, talking about like last week, talking about social media and everything, I live for like looking at social media advent calendar unboxings. Like the videos of people like unboxing the advent calendars, I love it.

Barry Conrad
I need to look that up and see what I'm missing out on.

Melanie Avalon
There are some, have you like explored this world at all? There are some that are insane.

And there's some really funny videos online because there will be ones that are like, what was the brand? Like really on like really bougie brands like Dior or Gucci or, and there's some funny unboxing videos cause they'll charge like thousands of dollars for the advent calendar. And then some of the things it's like, what? What are you giving me here? If you had to have an advent calendar, what would you do? Like a chocolate one, a food one, a wine one, like a brand one.

Barry Conrad
I would probably do definitely something that I can consume like, at least maybe like maybe a wine wine or chocolate or wine or both. Not, not a um, not necessarily, I don't know about a food or maybe chocolate or wine because it seems quite festive.

Melanie Avalon
I would like a organic wine, a dry-from-wines, oh, a dry-from-wines advent calendar. Oh, wait, maybe, wait, Barry. I should make an ad.

Barry Conrad
Create one? Yes.

Melanie Avalon
I could but how I would not be able to get the wine that that's really complicated. Okay, in the future, I'm gonna make that.

Okay, I wanted to see really quickly like the other menus if there's something really they have a Christmas Eve menu.

Barry Conrad
They also have a wine menu down at the bottom, but it only works if you click the PDF icon on the right because for some reason it's not, but there's so many wines.

Melanie Avalon
It looks like it's really similar things on their other menus. Okay, let me go to the wine list.

Barry Conrad
Cause I feel like I feel confident that you'll be able to find something here that you like wine wise.

Melanie Avalon
Is this their drinks too or just wine? Where's their cocktail menu?

Barry Conrad
Yeah, I don't know, I don't, I'm not sure if they have that. I'm sure that they do but I can't see it, which is fine. I like wine.

Melanie Avalon
Okay, this menu looks amazing. Oh, I don't speak milliliters. Is that like a, what pour is 125? Four ounces, okay, four ounces, and then 175 is six ounces, okay. I also love restaurants that have options for pours. It's like my favorite.

Because then you can like try things and get like a little bit more of something. Oh, they have a Coravin selection, we love that. Okay, I don't know what I would get because I have to like look, I would have to research them, but they have a lot of French, I would get probably a French wine, maybe a rose or a red. I probably tried multiple ones. Yeah, this looks great.

Barry Conrad
Looks amazing. I would get a bottle of their best Pinot Grigio.

Melanie Avalon
But what is best? What does that even mean?

Barry Conrad
I don't know. I need to get more educated in what they would want.

OK, this is what I would choose. I would choose what they like. Something from the land, something from there that is their finest Pinaguchi from the region.

Melanie Avalon
But we're in the U.K.

Barry Conrad
Okay. So probably, yeah, definitely French then. Okay.

Melanie Avalon
so not the region that we're in.

Barry Conrad
Yeah, not the reason that we're in.

Melanie Avalon
Do they even have wineries in the UK? That's like a really, I should know the answer to that. You don't normally see like England on the wine list. Nope. Awesome. Okay, do they have a cocktail list?

Barry Conrad
I can't see it, but that's totally fine because I feel like we actually ordered so much and I feel like this place has so many options to drink. We'd probably be having those 20 pieces of chocolate and then sipping in different pours.

Melanie Avalon
Yes. Okay. Oh, and they do. Last thing. So they're, they source locally and seasonal directly from UK fishing boats, lamb from the Welsh mountains, game from the Windsor Royal Park, poultry from family-run small holdings in Lancaster, and organically grown fruit and vegetables fresh from Kent each morning.

Okay, I'm down. This might be, this might be the place I want to go the most maybe. Wow. That's a big call. I know. Well, good find. Listeners, I hope you enjoyed your time with us this evening. If you would like to submit your own questions for the show, we would love, love, love to feature you. Just please email questions at ifodcast.com or you can go to ifodcast.com and you can submit questions there. These show notes for today's episode will be at ifpodcast.com slash episode 462 and you can get all the, all of the stuff that we like at ifodcast.com slash stuff we like. And then definitely tune in next week because we will go through the next five tips from that study that we were talking about. And yeah, I think that's all the things. Anything from you, Barry, before we go?

Barry Conrad
That's it. Thank you so much for tuning in. Again, listen to have the most amazing day and we'll talk to you next week.

Melanie Avalon
I'll talk to you next week. Bye.

Bye. Thank you so much for listening to the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. Please remember, everything we discussed on this show does not constitute medical advice and no patient doctor relationship is formed. If you enjoyed the show, please consider writing a review on iTunes. We couldn't do this without our amazing team. Editing by podcast doctors, show notes and artwork by Brianna Joyner and original theme composed by Leland Cox and re composed by Steve Saunders.

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