Welcome to Episode 363 of The Intermittent Fasting Podcast, hosted by Melanie Avalon, author of What When Wine Diet: Lose Weight And Feel Great With Paleo-Style Meals, Intermittent Fasting, And Wine and Vanessa Spina, author of Keto Essentials: 150 Ketogenic Recipes to Revitalize, Heal, and Shed Weight.
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SHOW NOTES
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Intermittent Fasting: Does It Affect Sports Performance? A Systematic Review
Metabolic Switching: An Intermittent Fasting Revolution with Dr. Mark Mattson - Part 1
Listener Q&A: Jennifer - What foods/supplements WON’T break a fast?
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Listener Q&A: Xenia - My doctor told me to stop 16:8 IF when I had serious bloating issue... (then Emily said why would you discontinue IF? It isn't a diet, it is a lifestyle and once you see all the benefits you won't want to stop and Sacy said In my experience, bloating was food related. Think carbs like pasta, bread, chips. Tweak the food.
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TRANSCRIPT
(Note: This is generated by AI with 98% accuracy. However, any errors may cause unintended changes in meaning.)
Melanie Avalon:
Welcome to Episode 363 of the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. If you want to burn fat, gain energy, and enhance your health by changing when you eat, not what you eat with no calorie counting, then this show is for you. I'm Melanie Avalon, biohacker, author of "What, When, Wine" and creator of the supplement line AvalonX. And I'm here with my co-host, Vanessa Spina, sports nutrition specialist, author of "Keto Essentials" and creator of the Tone Breath Ketone Analyzer and Tone Lux Red Light Therapy Bannals. For more on us, check out ifpodcast.com, melanieavalon.com, and ketogenicgirl.com. Please remember, the thoughts and opinions on this show do not constitute medical advice or treatment. To be featured on the show, email us your questions to questions@ifpodcast.com. We would love to hear from you. So pour yourself a mug of black coffee, a cup of tea, or even a glass of wine, if it's that time, and get ready for the Intermittent Fasting Podcast.
Melanie Avalon:
This is episode number 363 of the Intermittent Fasting Podcast. I'm Melanie Avalon, and I'm here with Vanessa Spina. Hello, everyone. How are you today, Vanessa? I'm doing wonderfully. How are you? I'm good. I had a meeting where I thought about you so much. Like, it was like a Vanessa meeting. Like, you needed to be there to experience it, I will tell you. Yeah, I don't know. We're currently designing packaging for my spirulina supplement. I know why you're talking about me. So I really just want to make the packaging like vibrant and beautiful and eye -catching, and, you know, all the things. So the design call meeting, it was like me and Scott, our partner at Empty Logic, and then like the whole design team. And so I had gathered like a lot of pictures of inspiration for like colors and, you know, the vibe I was feeling. And I found this picture of a mermaid. So for listeners, I just texted this mermaid to Vanessa so she can see it while I tell her the story. Did it come through?
Vanessa Spina:
Oh, yeah, that's beautiful.
Melanie Avalon:
Okay, so I saw this picture and the reason I love this mermaid is because because I want to make like a lot of supplements in the spirulina line like a spirulina and chlorella and a blend so I was like oh we can use like part of these colors for one we can use part of the mermaid colors for the other and we can kind of do all the colors for the blend and in my head before the meeting I was like I mean I would like to just do the mermaid honestly on the package but that's too I can't do mermaid like what who am I kidding so then we get on the phone call I like bring up this mermaid I'm like talking about the colors and then Scott Scott makes a comment I made like a throwaway comment like I would love to just have the mermaid like haha jokey jokey and then Scott was like well Starbucks is a mermaid and you know that does fine I was like oh door open you're right so then I was like the funny thing about the call was so Scott and I are like team mermaid the whole rest of the team they're like not no I'm not feeling it I kept being like these colors but like can we have the mermaid and then Scott Scott knew the team would like not really be down with it so he was trying to like hint at it without like really supporting it so he'd be like you know Melanie how do you feel about the mermaid and like we just kept like dancing around the mermaid like people and like Scott and I weren't sure like I wasn't sure if Scott really wanted the mermaid and Scott wasn't really sure like if I seriously wanted the mermaid but we were like trying to read each other out and we kind of thought we were on the same page so it was just like this whole thing about like the mermaid and isn't the mermaid amazing yes cuz cuz on the call they're like we can't do the mermaid I'm like what but can we do the mermaid are they gonna do the mermaid so now I've just decided that we have to do the mermaid like I'm gonna do whatever it takes to make this mermaid happen I've named her essence so beautiful do you know do you have like the artists and everything well that's the thing that was half the call we're like who created this mermaid and because I am because the name of the file is like a lot of numbers and I googled that and I couldn't find the original file but then I went through my initial like it was months ago but I was like I'm gonna find this mermaid so I tried to Google but I originally googled and I tried to like click on the pictures I had clicked on cuz you know like you click on the pictures and then it gives you more pictures and you click on the pictures it gives you more pictures so I sound it that way like going through the tunnel of Google Images it's AI and did you know that AI artwork cannot be copyrighted
Vanessa Spina:
Yeah, because Pete my husband's been using it a lot to make graphics for his articles And I'm like so you own this right like it's basically yours. We were just talking about this at dinner I was like, I'm pretty sure that that it's just yours. You can just use it
Melanie Avalon:
Yeah, it's like you can just use it but nobody owns it so like anybody can use it.
Vanessa Spina:
Right. So that's kind of like someone else could could take it and do it as well. But that's like, pretty low risk.
Melanie Avalon:
So I found the Etsy store that was selling like the high -res version and I was messaging them and I was I was like I don't want to like give off any flags. I was like, how do I like message and be like, is this copyrighted? I was like so worried. I was gonna do that. They were gonna like take it down and like Copyright it. Yeah, so fun fact ai artwork No copyrights. There might be a mermaid in the future somewhere
Vanessa Spina:
You know, it's funny because when I first opened the image, I was wondering if it was AI just because we were like looking at AI images over dinner that my husband was making. So it's like, yeah, it totally looks
Melanie Avalon:
that way. Did he find some programs that he likes online for that?
Vanessa Spina:
He's using something. I'm not sure what I, when I do it, it does a similar result and I'm using Canva, like there's a plug -in in Canva for it. This whole world of AI is... You would love this. I've been doing it with Luca, so like I did this only a couple times, like I was sitting on the couch with him and I was like, what do you want to see? And he was like, a rainbow choo -choo train by the river in Prague. So like we did that and it made a rainbow choo -choo train in Prague. You know, so we just like, we went through like three or four different pictures and he would just tell me whatever he wanted to see and it would, you know, make the image. So it was really with him. Yeah, I thought of you and I was like, Melanie would love this.
Melanie Avalon:
I'm smiling so much. That's like a whole other level of raising children, you know?
Vanessa Spina:
He's gonna grow up with this just being a thing like he just speaks into existence whatever he wants and it's there
Melanie Avalon:
Whoa. That's crazy. Oh my goodness. I love that. Well, on that note, anything new in your life? That's my mermaid update.
Vanessa Spina:
I mean mostly just baby life like everything is baby life. We're going to Spain next Sunday for a couple weeks because my parents are there so every year they come and spend some time in Spain and we go there and you know it's such a great place for kids like there's so many playgrounds. Every morning we just get up go to a playground there's usually a boardwalk by the beach there's so many different beaches and stuff there and there's always playgrounds like some have like big pirate ships and all kinds of stuff so Luca's really excited to see his grandparents to go on the airplane he's going to have his own seat like he just talks about it every single day how excited he is to go there and we're excited just to get some like nice weather like it started to be spring here but it's going to be a lot warmer and like have some beach days and stuff so it'll be really fun to go there for a couple weeks.
Melanie Avalon:
You know what's really interesting about that is with the playgrounds thing. So when you say that I immediately get so many memories to playgrounds. When I was growing up, they're all the playgrounds we would go to in Europe.
Vanessa Spina:
Oh, that's funny. Yeah, there's there's a lot. I mean, I'm sure Germany is similar, you know, to Spain and Prague, there's a playground, like on every corner, there's just so many, it's endless, which is really great when you have little, little kids.
Melanie Avalon:
I'm just getting so many memories. Like the playgrounds, they're like sturdy. They're like magical and they're like sturdy.
Vanessa Spina:
super colorful like there's this one that we go to in Spain that's just rainbow like it's total rainbow and every every part of it is a different you know rainbow color and Luca loves running around and saying all the colors names and yeah it's it's really fun so I'm really excited to get some travel in it's been a while since we went anywhere because I haven't been able to travel for a while so I'm excited for that.
Melanie Avalon:
Right, and you're the little travel bee.
Vanessa Spina:
Speaking of which, we said we were going to talk about your trip to London, so...
Melanie Avalon:
did it. And long story short for listeners, true story. So I supposed to go to London for like, how many days, three days or four days. I ended up, I went to Thanksgiving dinner, I came home. So I literally went for like a dinner.
Vanessa Spina:
It's, this is the most Melanie thing I've ever heard. I love it. And I know you did it twice, and then you were like, this is my new thing. I'm just gonna go places for a day.
Melanie Avalon:
Oh, I'm all about it. I'm all about it. Like I can do anything for a day. And you know, I have these moments. I mean, I know I'm an adult and I know I've been an adult for a while, which is weird. But like, you know, you have these moments where like, oh, I'm an adult. I had that moment. I like got back from the Thanksgiving dinner, which was fabulous. I went to see Charlotte Fox Weber. She's a guest. I found the Melanie Avalon biohacking podcast. I adore her. In any case, I went for a Thanksgiving party. So I like went to the party. I got back to my hotel that night and I was sitting in the hotel lobby and I was just so I had like a blast. But like I wanted to get back to work like I, I didn't want to like just like hang out in London for a few days by myself and not be working. So I was sitting in the lobby like probably like one or two am and I was like, Wait a minute. Because the first I was like, I'm still gonna be here for a few days. I was like, Wait a minute, I can fly back tomorrow. Like I can do that. Like I can change my flight. I can leave this hotel. I felt so adult. That's amazing. And so I did. And that's when I got COVID. Yeah, I felt so bad for you. You were so sick. Yeah, so it was a fun time. And now I do the Monday trips. Now I've done quite a few of them. And they're more to come.
Vanessa Spina:
That's so freeing, you know, I mean, we talk a lot about on this podcast about finding the thing that works for you, you know, trying different things, knowing yourself. And that's just like such a perfect example of it. Cause you know, in the past you may have said no to trips cause you didn't want to do all the travel or be gone for a long time. But now that, you know, you can just go for a day, like opens up this whole world of possibilities for
Melanie Avalon:
travel for you. It's amazing. And then I want to slowly, like, extend the days that I'm there, but, you know, work on that aspect. But, yeah, because people think what's bothering me is, like, the travel part or, you know, the travel part. But I'm like, no, the travel part's fine. It's like being away from—I just don't feel good with, like, my food and my digestion and my sleep and all of that for multiple days, but I can suck it up for a day.
Vanessa Spina:
It's a part of travel. I mean, a lot of people I you probably so many people listening to this have the experience of when their travel like they just don't go to the bathroom for like several days and stuff like, which is why for me, I always take magnesium citrate with me the magnesium calm, because like that usually doesn't happen for me, but if it does, like I'm not concerned, but so many people, I'll talk to they'll be like, Yeah, I went to Mexico and I like didn't go to the bathroom for a week. Like, oh my god.
Melanie Avalon:
So that freaks me out, like it freaks me out.
Vanessa Spina:
But it's such a common thing that when people travel, it like, you know, you're eating different foods, you're in different environments, there's different bacteria, like, it does affect most people's digestion, some people not at all, or just a little bit, and some people a lot. So you're not the only person, like, it's a very common part of traffic.
Melanie Avalon:
And actually, I'm so glad we're talking about this because I did want to talk about something for the listeners related to it. I was thinking a lot of the bowel movement issues are about it messing up your circadian rhythm with the travel because so much of that is tied to your circadian rhythm. I hadn't done an international trip since I've been fasting, so this was my first international trip with fasting. I didn't really have any jet lag. I implemented my theory I've been talking about for so long but hadn't personally implemented. I mean, I do it domestically, but that's only a few hours difference. I did it for this trip, and I don't want to say zero jet lag, but I don't remember having any jet lag. So basically, my protocol was I just ate my... So I do a one meal a day with a later meal, like a dinner meal. So the night before traveling, because I had a late night flight out, I stayed up super late, like more later than normal, had a massive meal like normal, slept in really late, went to the airport on the night flight, and then I just fasted the whole flight over. And then when I got to London, it was the morning. By the time I got to my hotel, it was the afternoon. I still didn't eat, so I was still fasted, and I just fasted till dinner. And then at dinnertime, I had an early dinner, and then I went to bed, and then it was completely normal the next day. And then on the way back, I did the same thing. I just did my normal dinner before the flight, and then I flew home the next morning, and then I fasted the whole flight, and then I ate dinner when I got back, and then I was completely normal the next day. Like zero. Besides the actual day landing there, where I was a little bit tired, there was zero jet lag. That's it.
Vanessa Spina:
That's great. That's what I always do. I usually fast on flying because it's easy. It's easy.
Melanie Avalon:
Yeah, and you can use your meals as an anchor, basically, to sync up your circadian rhythm to the new time zone. So if your body is accustomed to thinking, I eat this at this time, I eat this at dinner, I eat this at breakfast, I eat this at lunch, then it automatically, when you eat that meal again in that time zone, in that time zone's time for that meal, it just syncs you up. So, yeah, team fasting for jet lag.
Vanessa Spina:
Yeah, and I mean, my biggest thing for jet lag is just as soon as I land, say I land in Europe, is getting outside and getting as much light on myself as possible and going for a long walk. And I think that that's probably been helpful because it is helping you sync up with the wavelengths of light at that time of day, which is then triggering different hormones, you know, and helping you, you know, make melatonin more later and helping you with all that. So, yeah, that I think the light and the meals are two of the biggest things you can do to really help. I think that's
Melanie Avalon:
That's amazing, yes. And then my little hack that I have discovered, I don't know if I told you this, but one of the things I miss the most with travel is my cooling mattress. Like I have to have my cooling mattress. Have I told you my solution to this? No. Because you can't travel with a cooling mattress, but here's what you do. Are you ready? I love this so much. So you go, I always go to Whole Foods, which they, it is so nice that there's Whole Foods in Europe. I was like, oh, I feel like I'm at home.
Vanessa Spina:
The whole thing I do, if I go to Austin, I go to Whole Foods. If I go to London, I go to Whole Foods.
Melanie Avalon:
Although it's like different in the European whole foods. I was like, stuff is like different here, but in any case. So I always get the, they have like the whole foods brand leader glass bottles of water. So I always stock up on that water because that's why I drink at home. And then if I travel, I stock up on it to drink there. But if you get a mini fridge in the hotel room, keep the water in the mini fridge. And then at night when you're sleeping, you get out one of those really cold waters and you kind of cuddle it like it's a stuffed animal and like it keeps you really cold. Oh my gosh, that's amazing. And then you come out. So like, so you cuddle it and you want to get it by your like core so that it's like cooling you down. And then, you know, if you wake up like a few hours and it's warm, you just swap it out with a new cold, cold one and cuddle it again.
Vanessa Spina:
That's amazing. I mean, most people cuddle with a hot water bottle and you go with an ice cold bottle of water. I love it. Like you're such a cold girl. It's really in your DNA. Do you think it's in your DNA or do you think it's something that you have like trained yourself because you know all the benefits of cold?
Melanie Avalon:
Well, like growing up like in high school and like I would always like I love the heat and I love tanning and but I also was always hot like my mom would always be like, wear a coat and be like, I'm fine. I like feeling not inflamed, which is why the cold makes me feel. So I don't know. That's a good question. How about you?
Vanessa Spina:
For me, I definitely have trained myself. Like I never liked being cold growing up. I think it's because I under ate protein. But now I'm the person I was the person who was always cold. I think I was under eating calories a lot and I was under eating protein. And now I'm the person who's always too warm. Like I walking around in t shirts. It's not that warm here, but it's been we've been getting a little bit of spring sun and I've been out in t shirts. We went ice skating. Last weekend, we took Luca for the first time and I was in a t shirt the whole time. You know, and I love that. Like I love the feeling of the cold air, but I have made myself deliberately more cold adapted. And I also love that I've made myself cold adapted because I feel like it's a superpower that I'd much rather be wanting to, you know, cool off and to enjoy cold exposure, especially because I know how beneficial it is. You know, in the morning I go outside and stand in the sun or do some grounding and it's freezing cold, but it feels amazing to me. And I much prefer that to when I was a teenager, you know, we did a ton of winter sports and I was always freezing. Like I was always cold and resisting the cold, you know, and not enjoying it. Whereas now, you know, I love it and I love that you can make yourself more cold adapted. So I'm one of those people who will make myself learn to love and embrace things because I know that they're good for me. And I think that that's like, it's kind of a cool thing to be able to do, but it's definitely, it's probably in our DNA, you know, but we like moved away from it towards comfort for so long. And then when you realize that it's better to embrace these things, then maybe you go back more to like how we're originally optimized.
Melanie Avalon:
is for? I think, no, I think it's so true. I had that moment recently where I was like, oh, this does feel like a superpower. Because I was reflecting on how, I was reflecting on how whenever I have guests back to my apartment, even if they're like men who you would think would be like, you know, resilient, because I keep my apartment cold, like cold. And all the men who have come over here are like, freezing. And I'm like, I'm fine. And I was like, thinking about it, I'm like, I, this is like a superpower, you know, I'm like, resilient, I can like handle the elements, even though I can't really handle the elements. But I love the cold, team cold over here. Quick travel plug for people, if they would like to come hang out with me. Oh, speaking of travel, Vanessa, you should come to the biohacking conference in Dallas. Is it happening already again? It's in May. Yes. Wow, that's crazy. I'm excited. So it's going to be so amazing. It's at the end of May, through the beginning of April, it's like three days. So look at me, I'm going to be there more than one day. Definitely come. There's so many guests I've had on the podcast. So I was looking at the lineup, it's people like Paul Saladino, Dr. Mercola, Sarah Gottfried, Anna Kebecke, there's like so many people. And then there's this massive expo where you can try all the health and biohacking things, meet all the people. We can hang out. So please come listeners. And if you're coming, please let me know so that we can meet. So if you go to melanieavilon .com slash biohacking conference, oh, and this is Dave Asprey's biohacking conference, by the way. So he'll be there as well. Use the coupon code BCMelanie and that coupon code will get you a massive discount. I think when this airs, it'll be a 30% discount. So again, melanieavalon.com/biohackingconference, coupon code BCMelanie, please come hang out. I will be there and we'll have so much fun. So I think that's all the things. And then one last plug for people, we are about to close out our special giveaway we're doing for the show. So this is a chance to win the entire AvalonX line, Vanessa's Tone Protein, and a special surprise from MD Logic. So you will win, are you ready? You will win my Sera Peptase, which is great to take in the fasted state. It really helps support your fast because it helps you break down problematic proteins, sort of like what autophagy does. So it helps with inflammation, clears your sinuses, clears your brain fog. Studies have shown it can reduce cholesterol, it can reduce amyloid plaque, in vitro and in vivo. Again, animal studies, but still pretty cool. So you'll get that. You'll get my Magnesium 8, which is a broad -spectrum magnesium blend because most people are deficient in magnesium. That's great for muscle recovery, sleep, just energy overall. You'll get my Magnesium Nightcap, which is a special type of magnesium, which crosses the blood -brain barrier. It helps with memory and mood, as well as sleep and relaxation. You will get my berberine, which is amazing for blood sugar control. If you're really trying to optimize your fasting and your eating and take charge of your metabolic health, berberine is incredible for that. When I wear a CGM, I see a massive difference in my blood sugar response when I am taking my berberine, specifically. I've compared it to other berberines. You will get Vanessa's Tone Protein. Vanessa, would you like to tell them about your tone protein?
Vanessa Spina:
I would love to. Well, first of all, it tastes absolutely delicious because it's flavored with a vanilla bean. And everyone says they absolutely love taking everyday look forward to it as a special treat, but it's also scientifically optimized to help you build muscle and get toned and lean. So it's enhanced with leucine. So you know that you're triggering muscle protein synthesis with every serving. So it's scientifically formulated for optimal muscle growth and it also tastes delicious.
Melanie Avalon:
So you will get that and we recorded an episode episode before last all about the awesome benefits of protein actually before workouts how you can still burn equal amounts of fat as fasting as with protein prior to a workout so that's prior to a workout but also that protein would be great for refueling after a workout and Vanessa is the best of the best for formulation so you definitely definitely want that tone protein you will also get a special surprise from one of MD logics favorite supplements I'm not sure what they're going to throw in but I'm sure it will be awesome they have a wide broad range of supplements so if you would like to win all of that which is worth definitely a couple hundred bucks go to apple podcast subscribe to the show and write a brief review if you've already written a review before no worries you can update your old review to update it for something new and sparkly or you could create a new account and write a new review we would really love that but in any case do that and send a screenshot of the review to questions at if podcast .com and we will enter you to win the prize which is really really awesome so again subscribe brief review on apple podcasts or update your old review send us a screenshot to questions at ifodcast .com and you will win avallonix sarah peptase magnesium 8 magnesium nightcap berberine vanessa's tone protein and something special from MD logic all of that is worth a couple hundred bucks super awesome yeah okay shall we get into some fasting stuff for today I would love to answer some questions before that I have a really fun little quick review I was going to share a study it's actually just a review but it's from January 2024 so it's pretty new and it is a systemic review published in nutrients and it's called intermittent fasting does it affect sports performance a systemic review so the purpose of the study was to investigate whether or not intermittent fasting affects performance and professional athletes they wanted to look on the effects of aerobic and anaerobic exercise strength and power body composition including fat mass muscle mass and weight and see how intermittent fasting affected all of that the majority of the studies they looked at were time restricted feeding with a 16 hour fasting window and an eight hour feeding window there were a couple that were 14 eight hour fasting and those were primarily in Ramadan and they did look at one that looked at just quote overnight fasting their conclusion was. So looking at all the reviews, they found that first of all, they said that they could affirm that intermittent fasting of any type metabolically affects the body composition in a positive way. So it helps with body weight specifically. They said that it's a adequate nutritional strategy to reduce body fat percentage to a good number for the athlete. So that number is between 6% to 12% body fat for men and 12% to 18% body fat for women while, and this is key, maintaining muscle mass. So I think that is just so, so important. They also found that studies showed that fasting patients had greater adherence than other dietary approaches. So basically it's fasting is something that you can really stick to and is good for the long term. And interestingly, they actually found that in general, the fasting was actually more effective in the medium and long term than in the short term. And I just want to focus on this for a second because so often when we think of things like dieting or calorie restriction, it's always said that, yeah, it works in the short term, but not in the long term. Well, they actually found literally the opposite, which is what we want, that fasting is more effective in the medium and the long term than the short term, which I thought was super cool. They found that in general fasting improves metabolic health and insulin sensitivity and glucose and lipid metabolism. So that's sugar and fat metabolism in the body, all in ways that would be beneficial for the athlete. In particular, it seems to have a beneficial effect on adiponectin hormone, which low levels of adiponectin are actually associated with obesity, oxidative stress, and insulin resistance. So they found a good effect there. And they found that fasting does not negatively affect sports performance. And I already said this, but that it does improve body composition. So takeaway, again, this is a review from January 2024, but their findings were that fasting is basically a really good approach for professional athletes. Any comments there, Vanessa?
Vanessa Spina:
I think that's amazing. I mean, there's so many detractors about intermittent fasting. And yet I know when I was interviewing Dr. Mark Madsen, who's sort of one of the founders of intermittent fasting, he did some of the early research on it. And he found, you know, that it was amazing for, you know, BDNF, brain derived neurotrophic factor, and that it was helping the athletes at his university. And he was really wanting to put their whole university track team on intermittent fasting, because he, he personally saw that with his running, that it was improving it. And he was like, we're going to be, you know, unbeatable if my, if the whole track team does intermittent fasting, but you know, he, he couldn't do it with the students there. But I remember him saying that, you know, he thought it was like the super powerful athletes for sure.
Melanie Avalon:
That's so amazing. I love anecdotes like that. I need to, how many times have you interviewed him, Dr. Mattson?
Vanessa Spina:
Just once, I did one interview with him on the optimal protein podcast.
Melanie Avalon:
Okay, very cool. And he's like a legend in the fasting sphere. He's done so much, so much research with fasting. So that's amazing. Yeah.
Vanessa Spina:
Yeah, I think he's one of the main reasons that intermittent fasting took off in the first place is definitely his research. That's incredible.
Melanie Avalon:
So, okay, and we'll put a link in the show notes to Vanessa's episode with Dr. Matson so people can check that out. And okay, shall we jump into some questions for today? Yes, I would love to. So to start things off, we have a question from Jennifer. We get questions like this all the time, but it's always nice to revisit and kind of just give an overview or approach to it. So she wants to know what foods slash supplements won't break a fast. She says she takes collagen powder, MCT oil, omega -3 oil, and she's read that a tablespoon of cream might be okay, but is any of that true?
Vanessa Spina:
So my personal golden rule with this is basically anything that has any calories in it or that's going to stimulate any anabolic processes or building or growth processes is not suitable for fasting because you want to only be in that catabolic or breakdown mode when you're in fasted mode. And so you are activating the AMPK pathway, which is associated with the longevity and health benefits that are provided from doing fasting. So I personally think, you know, if you're ever in doubt, just ask yourself, does this have any calories in it? So that means there are actually some supplements that you can take fasted as long as they don't say take with food on them because they don't have any calories at all. And they're not triggering any anabolic processes. But if we look at your list, for example, you know, collagen powder, does it have calories in it? Yes. So it does break a fast MCT oil. Does it have calories in it? Yes. So we'll break it fast. Omega three oil. Does it have calories in it? Yes. So we'll break it fast. So cream does have calories definitely will break it fast. So I think that one of the reasons there's a lot of confusion about this is because there are people who follow sort of the, you know, four different forms of fasting and keto, like the bulletproof sort of coffee kind of thing where, you know, that was always advocated as, well, this won't break your fast because it doesn't have any carbs in it. So in a sense, you know, there are people who advocate for fat fasts where, okay, we know that you're really not triggering as much insulin as if you're having carbs or protein. That's definitely true. But if it has calories in it, then in my opinion, you're taking the body out of the fasted state. So that's kind of, I'm pretty black and white on it. And that's how I tend to look at things. So being in the fasted state, for me, you know, there are things that you can get away with, like mostly water, plain tea, element, unflavored, I think it's called the raw element, which is basically just the electrolytes, you know, those things don't have calories in them. And they're not stimulating any growth pathways, anything anabolic. So what about you, Melanie?
Melanie Avalon:
Three thoughts to it. One, if listeners would like free element, you can go to drinklmnt .com slash if podcast, that will get you a free sample pack, which will include that raw unflavored one. So definitely that would be a great supplement for your fast, the raw unflavored, which actually brings me to the second point, which is like an element sample pack, you also get all the other flavors. And so those are an example of something that is non caloric, so no calories, but they have a, like a sweet taste to them. I consider that breaking a fast, even though it's non caloric, which I love Vanessa's pillar about the calories, even though it's non caloric, it's sending signals to your body of flavor and food and sweetness, which can affect your insulin and you know, have a hormonal effect from there. So I basically do the two pillars like the calorie pillar that Vanessa talked about, and then does it evoke sweetness or the taste of food, even if it's non caloric. That's a really simple way to like two pillars to look at. But the third thing I thought about was, I guess we haven't recorded since I recorded the in person podcast with Dave for this show, right? That was also before. Yes, we have not recorded together, right? Yes, that's right. Crazy. I was thinking about it because you mentioned bulletproof. And also I asked Dave, so I'll put links in the show notes to the episodes that I did with Dave. But I asked him, you know, this question, of course, he has a very opinionated, intense opinion about this, which is a little bit contrary to what we said. That was crazy. I forgot, Vanessa, have you done in person podcasts before?
Vanessa Spina:
I have been a couple, but I was being interviewed, so it wasn't me interviewing like you did. you
Melanie Avalon:
Yeah, I was like, this is a whole like, this is a whole another experience. Having to, it was a lot. It was a lot to take in. Because being interviewed, like you said, is one thing, but you're you're just answering the questions. But I was like, prepping and I had my notes, but it was like on camera. And it was with Dave Asprey, who's like a legend. And it was like a lot to take in and I was traveling for it. So but it was a magical time. So listeners, definitely, definitely check it out. I want to do more in person podcasts now, actually, which is crazy. It inspired me. So Okie Dokie, I think we answered that question. Shall we go on to Zena's question?
Vanessa Spina:
Yes. So Xenia from Facebook says, my doctor told me to stop 16, eight intermittent fasting when I had a serious bloating issue. He couldn't tell me why I had a bloating issue. I did some tests and just minor stomach inflammation, but he said that I should stop 16, eight intermittent fasting, but I'm seeing people having all kinds of benefits from intermittent fasting, including fixing gut issues. And what if I start having weight gain after discontinuing with IF? What should I do? Then Emily said, why would you discontinue IF? It isn't a diet. It's a lifestyle. And once you see all the benefits, you won't want to stop. Stacy said, in my experience, bloating was food related. Think carbs like pasta, bread, chips, tweak the food.
Melanie Avalon:
Awesome. So I love this question from Zinnia. I love the feedback that listeners provided as well. Okay, so Zinnia went to her doctor and her doctor said to stop IF because of her bloating. This doesn't really make sense to me. Okay, I have a few different thoughts. One, the actual fasted process itself is like Zinnia mentioned, healing for the gut. She's saying that she's heard the benefits of IF including fixing gut issues. So resting the gut is a great chance for it to heal and repair itself. Any bloating you would get from the actual fast would probably, and I reserve the right to be not completely comprehensive or adjust if new information comes out. But from my current understanding, really the only bloating that would be caused by fasting itself, not the eating on the flip side, but by the actual fasting would be a sort of die -off that people can get. So if you're starving some bad gut microbes, they can get a little bit unhappy and they can release metabolic byproducts which might contribute to bloating. That would be temporary though if you are fixing your gut, working on your foods, addressing your microbiome. So that would be a temporary thing and it's not something where you need to stop fasting. Now, if you get bloating while fasting, it's probably from kind of like what the listeners were like Stacy was saying with being the food related. It's probably from the food you're eating after the fasting and it could be accentuated or made a little bit worse because in the fasting pattern, you might now be eating a larger bolus of food at once than you were before. So before if you were eating just throughout the day, you would be constantly digesting that food at more of a baseline compared to fasting. And then if you're eating like a large bolus of food, you might be getting some digestive distress from that. So it could be just the actual load of the food being too much for you and or the actual foods that you're eating may be problematic and maybe eating them in a larger amount at once is a problem. So some ways to address that, I mean, two big pillars there. One, digestive support can be amazing. So taking some HCL, which is basically like our stomach acid and you can get it in supplement form that can really help with digestion, especially for digestion of protein. And you know, we're all about the high protein meals around here. And then digestive enzymes can be really great to help break down just all the things. I actually, Teaser probably will have a line out for this in the future. Right now what I currently take, I use pure encapsulations for their digestive enzymes and their HCL. So you can try that. And then also the actual foods you're eating, the bloating is probably caused by the foods you're eating or an extension, the foods, how they're being digested and metabolized by your gut bacteria, which are affected by the foods you're eating as well. So it all kind of like goes full circle. So I would really, I wouldn't stop IF, look at your food choices and try to find what you do digest. Going on an elimination diet temporarily can be really helpful for that. Definitely get my app FoodSense Guide. That's at melonieavilon .com slash FoodSense Guide. I'm happy to announce it is now free. It used to be a paid app, but I actually made it free. So you can subscribe beyond that for other features in it, but there is a free version. So that is a comprehensive guide to over 300 foods. And it'll show you what different potentially problematic food compounds are high in each food. So you can kind of see like, oh, if I'm reacting to, you know, these foods, you can like see what compounds they're high in. And it might turn out that you have a problem with FODMAPs or you have a problem with lectins or you have a problem with histamine. So that might be a valuable tool. Also taking something I love to help with this that has been incredible for my bloating has been to, well, for me to a low FODMAP diet. So I use my FoodSense Guide app for that. And then having my fast and then ending my fast. There's this supplement. I want to make my own version one day. It's called Dr. Danielle Gut Assist. I have tried a lot of different leaky gut support powders. And they usually have some combination of glutamine with some other things. I love this one. I literally, I've tried so many. So it has L -glutamine, it has D -glycerinated licorice extract, which I've tried that one by itself as well. But I like it in this blend. It has some aloe and it has some arabino -galactin. So I take that as a supplement at the end of my fast. And I found that really, really helps my overall digestion and bloating. So to recap, Zinnia, I would not stop the, I mean, I don't want to go against your doctor. So work with your practitioner or find a new one. I would keep going with the bloating and then kind of like, so Stacy talked about the food -related things. And then Emily was saying, why would you discontinue IF? It isn't a diet. It's a lifestyle. And once you see all the benefits, you won't want to stop. I do think that a lot of listeners and people, IF becomes a lifestyle for them. And all of that said, we kind of talked about this a little bit with Vanessa's eating window in the past. That said, don't feel like you have to be on one certain type of fasting forever and ever. Like you should feel free and the ability to change around your fasting window. So I think the best of both worlds is seeing fasting as a lifestyle and also knowing you have flexibility within that to change and adapt accordingly. So I don't think we ever want like a fear mindset or over restriction or anything like that. So I just want to encourage that mindset surrounding all of that. I also have thoughts about the weight gain after discontinuing. But Vanessa, do you have any thoughts about the bloating and all the things?
Vanessa Spina:
I think you entered it really thoroughly. I'd love to hear your thoughts on the waking.
Melanie Avalon:
I was just going to say to that that like people really get, you know, worried about weight gain after discontinuing with IF and well, A, goes back to IF can be a lifestyle and it's always in your back pocket and you can always keep doing it. But having this fear about weight gain, I just really want to empower people that you can always, even if you're not doing fasting, you can always make food choices that support your body and you don't have to gain weight. And I know that sounds like really simple and simplistic, so maybe I'll elaborate on it a little bit more, but so say you do stop fasting and you go back to eating throughout the day. Your body requires a certain amount of nutrients and calories every single day and you don't have to be restrictive to maintain, especially if you're making whole foods choices and focusing on protein, there's just so much potential basically in your food choices. And when you get out of the mindset of like, it's all about calories and if I eat this amount of calories or if I'm eating at these times, I'm going to gain weight, I would just try to add some comfort in that focus on what you can have and, you know, try to not focus on the fear mindset about gaining weight. Think about things that like if you focus on protein, for example, that's going to fill you up, especially lean protein and lean protein itself does not easily become fat. I mean, we even talked about a study recently where fueling with lean protein before exercise, people still burn fat similar to fasted exercise, which is so, so mind blowing. So focusing on foods that don't even normally become fat, so eating protein and then eating whole foods that, you know, require, they require energy to be broken down. They have a thermogenic effect. They're not just easily shuttled into fat. I just want to encourage people to, to kind of lose that fear if they can. Yeah, that was a lot of thoughts. Any, any thoughts, Vanessa?
Vanessa Spina:
Just I guess the last note that I would say about the bloating is I really recommend trying an elimination protocol. And for me, I did that for a month doing carnivore, you don't have to do it for a whole month, but carnivore diet, just eating mostly meat, I think you did it recently for like, almost two weeks, like 10 days. It's a period of time where you can just only give your body something that generally does not cause much bloating for people. And what I found is that when I did only meat, then I was able to reintroduce certain plant foods, and I was able to see what actually did cause bloating for me. And after I figured out what that was, like for me, it was a lot of cruciferous vegetables, a lot of the cabbage family, broccoli, cauliflower, you know, a lot of times people eat these foods because we're told they have anti cancer properties, and they're really good for you. And a lot of people incorporate them into your diet. But for me, it was causing me so much bloating. And as soon as I figured out what it was, I was able to, you know, reintroduce other foods, and not have to deal with bloating anymore. So I think that elimination protocols can be really helpful to sort of figure out if there is something that you're habitually consuming that is actually causing bloating for you. And it's a food sometimes that you may not think it is. And it could surprise you. But then once you figure it out, then, you know, you don't have to deal with bloating anymore, which, you know, I've been free of bloating for four or five years now since I figured that out. And I know from having dealt with it in the past, how uncomfortable and stressful it is, and it may not be being caused by food. I'm glad you're seeing a specialist about it to figure out the root cause of it. But elimination protocols can be really powerful, you know, for figuring that out.
Melanie Avalon:
I'm so glad you talked about that because that reminded me of an incredible resource for listeners. So we had the founders of Victus88 on the show. This is the food sensitivity test. I am obsessed with friends, so I was always looking for a food sensitivity test that would actually show you what you were sensitive to. Because most of them just look at IgG or IgM, which isn't the full picture, they actually look at the full picture, which is not just IgG and IgM, your immune reactions, but these two really important things called C3D as well as IgG4. And basically, I don't want to get all in the nuance and the weeds of it, but basically what they do is they show you what your body is actually reacting to. And then they show you if your body has created tolerance because it's possible that you're having an IgG or an IgE response. And I said that earlier, I think I said IgM, they look at IgG, IgE, IgG4, and C3D. They show you not only are you responding to a certain food, but is your body either A, have tolerance, so it's actually not a problem, or B, are you only responding a little bit, but your body is amplifying that response, and that's what that C3D response is. So that was a lot of letters. It's a mind -blowing test, and I think it really helps show listeners what foods may or may not be a problem, and even on the meat side of things. So when I did it, I found that I thought, oh, carnivore, any meat goes, but I found that I actually respond, for example, some I have zero response to, like pork is completely fine for me. Cod is fine. Shrimp is fine. Scallops, which I eat all the time, have a little bit of a response, but they have this complementary other aspect, which makes them be tolerant to it, which is so fascinating. But then I actually do have a little bit of reaction to chicken and beef, which made me sad. I was like, what? And also, people can find that addressing their that if they do multiple tests, addressing their gut health and their digestion, that they might adapt and change over time, which is incredible. So if you it's called Victus 88, you can get $55 off with the code Melanie Avalon. Just go to Melanie Avalon dot com slash Victus 88. That's B I C T U S eight eight. So that could be really, really eye opening for everybody to see what foods like literally see what foods there are problematic for them, like right here, right now. And then you can make actually walks you through a elimination. It gives you options like an intense elimination protocol to try or a more approachable elimination protocol where you just cut things out every few days. So it's really amazing. We'll put links to all that in the show notes. So I think that is all the things as a brief reminder for listeners. If you would like to win the entire avallonix line, as well as messes tone protein, as well as a special surprise from IndiLogic, go to Apple podcasts, write a brief review and subscribe or update your old review and send a screenshot of that to questions. I a podcast dot com. Another resource if you'd like to hang out with me and Dave Asprey and Paul Saladino and Dr. Sarah Gottfried and Anna Kebecke and so many guests I've had on my show. Definitely come to Dave Asprey's 10th annual biohacking conference in Dallas. It's this may be code B C. Melanie will get you 30% off at melanieavallon .com slash biohacking conference. You can get these show notes for today's show with links to all of this. So all these things I'm hitting you with, they'll all be in the show notes. They'll be at I a podcast dot com slash episode 363. You can follow us on Instagram. We are I a podcast. I am Melanie Avalon. Vanessa is ketogenic girl and you can follow me on my new TikTok. Please come hang out with me there. I feel really lonely. So please come. That is Melanie Avalon biohacker. Whoo. Okay. I think that is all the things. Vanessa, this was so wonderful. Thank you for, I want to say thank you to Vanessa because she's like a champ. She's doing these recordings while having, you know, a newborn. So, so much gratitude to you for, for being here and this has been so amazing.
Vanessa Spina:
That's so sweet. I'm so happy to be back recording with you. I'm excited for us to get back to our regular recording schedule and just excited for, yeah, all the future episodes. I had so much on with you. Me too.
Melanie Avalon:
Well, I will talk to you next time.
Vanessa Spina:
next week. Sounds great. Talk to you then. Bye.
Melanie Avalon:
Bye. Thank you so much for listening to the Intermittent Fasting podcast. Please remember, everything we discussed on this show does not constitute medical advice, and no patient -doctor relationship is formed. If you enjoyed the show, please consider writing your review on iTunes. We couldn't do this without our amazing team. Administration by Sharon Merriman, editing by podcast doctors, show notes and artwork by Brianna Joyner, and original theme composed by Leland Cox and re -composed by Steve Saunders. See you next week!
Melanie Avalon:
Thank you so much for listening to the Intimation Fasting Podcast. Please remember, everything we discussed on this show does not constitute medical advice and no patient-doctor relationship is formed. If you enjoyed the show, please consider writing a review on iTunes. We couldn't do this without our amazing team. Administration by Sharon Merriman, editing by Podcast Doctors, show notes and artwork by Brianna Joyner, and original theme composed by Leland Cox and recomposed by Steve Saunders.
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Melanie's What When Wine Diet: Lose Weight And Feel Great With Paleo-Style Meals, Intermittent Fasting, And Wine
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The Tone Device Breath Ketone Analyzer
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